Dubious Grading Services

Stick with PCGS & NGC and you'll be fine. ANACS is ok for varities & authentication of key dates. As a dealer I often read that ICG is well accepted and even preferred but my personal experience is that ICG coins are the kiss of death and are almost completely unsalable. I don't like them and will only buy them at a discount, just like any other offbrand service.
Enjoy the hobby, Avery and post any questions here. There's lots of good folk to help out whenever needed.
tradernick

I hope Morgan Fred means that the opinions held of the third/fourth tier is low, and not that the information expressed itself is of low quality.

The following are sham TPG's run by Corey & Sandi Brower of Tampa.

Hallmark Coin Grading Service (not the one of a decade or so ago)
American Numismatic Copmpany
Numismatic Coin Grading Service https://www.ncgsgrading.com
Numismatic Assurance Grading Corp
US Coin Grading

The scam works like this: Corey buys coins at coin dealers and coin shows all throughout Florida. They then clean and alter many of the coins. They use generic coin holders for the Hallmark coins and custom made tape to seal the holders. With the ANC coins they use the Ihobb holders, you can plainly see the Ihobb logo. They print a simple label and seal it inside the holder. They then recruit "listing assistants" with ads on Craigslist.com. They email the pics to the lister and pay them $3 per listing to list the coins. All the coins are shipped out of Tampa even though the lister may live anywhere in the U.S.
There's a lot more to it. They had created web sites for each of the so called grading companies but have recently took them down. The web site for Hallmark was at https://www.hcgshallmark.com. The Hallmark site was registered to Jorge Socorro, Jorge has worked for the Brower's for many years. The address for Hallmark given on the web site is a mail box rental place on Robson St. in Vancouver. The registers address was a box in California and Jorge lives in Tampa. A similar story for the ANC web site https://www.anccoin.com - registered to Betty Spencer at Jorge's address in Tampa. At both web sites there was no phone number, the link for a submission form did not work, and any emails sent through the web site went directly to the Brower's.
The Brower's are careful to have everything at arm's length. The coin holders are all purchased using Nancy Reyno's name and Paypal account. The return address is always that of the lister.
Many of the coins are cleaned, altered, or misrepresented. They are all over graded. When a coin is returned that was grossly over graded they simply would repackage it in another holder with a lower grade. As the Brower's are not coin dealers many of the coin variations are also misrepresented. Unsuspecting collectors may not catch this. I even have evidence that a different coin was pictured in the listing than what was shipped.

The only working web site now is https://www.ncgsgrading.com. Note there is no phone number, the address is a mail box drop, and the submission form does not work.

I was a lister for them in 2006. At first I was thought it was legit and a good way to make some extra money. I soon had my doubts and when I was suspended from ebay I did some investigation and uncovered the scam.

I have been in contact with Susan McMillan at ANA. A few listers have been suspended since then but the Browers just continue on with new sham TPG's.

I am not a coin collector and am only providing this info as a service to the community. I have set my email to off but will check back from time to time on this thread.

Frank

Note: this post is undergoing factual research by the administrative staff

Thanks for the detective work Dave. I also noticed both addresses are the same except for the zip codes. While it's possible to have the same two street addresses with different zips, like 15 Main Street, I highly doubt there are that many Chantilly places with five digit numbers in Tampa. lololol.

Again, thanks for the info.

For Hallmark, a search of "Robson Street Vancouver" reveals it to be a mail box drop. Also, they used a Registrar in Australia, an IP address in California, a PO box in California for the registrar, and a mail box drop in Canada. All part of the deception. "Chantilly" is just a typo as is "Beatty". Should be Gentilly and Betty.

On the NCGS site the info on their grading page that they copyright is simply copied from Heritage Auction Galleries
http://coins.ha.com/common/contactu...xtTopicID=30

NCGS is a registered LLC in Florida. I could not find any business license or corporate entity for Hallmark or ANC anywhere in the country.

They are getting slicker with their deception

Morgan Fred: I believe that ICG backs up its grades with a money back guarantee. However, if its some modern carp, then they typically like to exhange it for a like coin (ie an MS/PF70 for the same coin in MS/PF70).

I will also say that ICG is a very reputable company with some very strong talent working for them. The lead counterfeit expert in the country, J.P. Martin, works for them. I know many of the ICG staff, I've owned, bought, and sold ICG coins. I personally am very impressed with their classic grading. I find them to be more conservative than most services, including the "top tier"

I do agree, that resale can be tough due to a huge amount of ignorance and trepidation of buyers that keep hearing the same stupid horror stories.

I have ordered a few coins off ebay that were graded by the "basement slabbing services" (BSS for short)

I have a 1942 S Lincoln Cent slabbed by NNC as MS66. My notes say that the coin may BARELY grade MS65/66, and it is spotted. It might deserve a 65 net, but worst case, it drops to 64/65 for a MS64 Red net.
I have a 1942 D Lincoln slabbed NNC MS66. This one is spotted and I grade it MS65 Red/Brown/MS66 Red.

I have a 1949 S Lincoln slabbed NNC MS 67. I grade this one as a MS 63 or 64/65.

I bought a 1878 Seated Liberty quarter slabbed as AU 55 by PCI. I'm not good at differentiating coins in these grades, but I think it grades at least an EF 45, which makes me happy, because I paid about $90 for it.

I bought a 1999 P Susan B. Anthony dollar slabbed by CGI as MS68. I paid $9, so I didn't lose, even though the dollar only grades about MS65/66.

I bought an 1875 Indian cent slabbed by ANACS as VF 20. I paid $46, which is still a decent price considering I'm not sure the coin deserves the VF20.

I bought a 1970S Kennedy half slabbed by GEC as PR70 DCAM. I only see two very tiny spots on the obverse, and a few similarly tiny spots on the reverse that detract from this coin. I'm not sure how to grade coins in this grade, but I'm guessing the spots don't drop the grade any lower than PR 68. I do not however see ANY cameo contrast, let alone DEEP cameo contrast on this coin.

I realize it would be very helpful to post photos of these coins. Too bad I have all of them locked up in my safe deposit boxes. Maybe one day I'll pull them out and photograph them for educational purposes.

The moral is: DON'T expect your coins to meet the grade if they're graded by one of the smaller services. In fact, even some of the big guys can be questioned occasionally...