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 Replies: 25 / Views: 3,024 |
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Valued Member
United States
78 Posts |
I bought this from Turkey 25 years ago from a coin dealer, has anyone seen this before? looks that is hand stamped .   does anyone knows what's the value on it? PS. It's silver, I believe it weighs 1 ounce , and it's bigger than a silver dollar in diameter |
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
I was in the Grand Bazaar in Istanbul, way back in 1970.
At the time fake everythings could be bought there, and from what I remember, the quality of those fakes would fool most people. That included maps, watches, antique clocks, jewelry, pictures and fabrics, as well as collector coins, mainly purporting to be Turkish, British or ancient.
Even then, I had learnt a little about British gold coins. I had a complete type set of sovereigns and half sovereigns, all with Australian mint marks. I was also learning a bit about horology, and hence my interest in timepieces of the 17th and 18th centuries although I didn't own any.
I saw dozens very good quality fake gold coins, all in quite good quality gold.
I would need to do a little research before offering ANY opinion on these, but my previous background would be the direction I would be coming from.
Nevertheless, large and genuine Turkish silver and billon coins of the 19th century can be relatively easy to obtain. I suspect that quite a few Turkish families would have a few old silver coins as an heirloom. That is part of their culture.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1391 Posts |
How do you know it is unique?
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Valued Member
 United States
78 Posts |
I really don't, its unique for me thus I haven't seen one before , plus it's silver.
I just want to know how much it cost these days and if its real.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1666 Posts |
Appears to be cast, whereas genuine Ottoman coins were struck.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1391 Posts |
Okay. When you said it was unique it seemed to me that you implied some more details you hadn't shared in the post. The details do look a little mushy. If I am reading the date right it would be 1223 (A.D. 1808). Which would be either Mustafa IV or Mahmud II. But I can't find a coin exactly like the one you posted. I'll keep looking but Ottoman coins are not my strong point.
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
2490 Posts |
Looks like a 5 Kurush of Mahmud II. But the details are very mushy, could be cast.
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Valued Member
United States
78 Posts |
how can I determine if it's real or not?
all I know is that's real silver by the soundhe
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1391 Posts |
Edited by allranger
12/29/2013 10:33 pm
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Valued Member
United States
78 Posts |
I found them on ebay for around $250 and they claim thaf they are rare! What is a best place to sell a coin like this? I will sell it and buy bullion round with that money |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1391 Posts |
Everything is rare on ebay. Type in rare and see what you get. You need to go back and read sel's comment again. Then think about how you got two 'rare' coins. You also have three people who think there is some concern on whether or not they are cast instead of being struck. That is a huge red flag. Based off what you pics are showing I would not buy those coins. The porous spots on the edge of each one is what I am worried about. You will need to find someone who can authenticate them for you. Someone who knows more can comment on that, like I said Ottoman coins are not my thing. As for selling coins like that (if they are real), for silver rounds. You may want to get your noggin checked. But that is just me! |
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Valued Member
United States
78 Posts |
okay will do, thank you everyone for your help
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1666 Posts |
Quote:
The porous spots on the edge of each one is what I am worried about This, and the dead giveaway is the extra material rising up around the rims on one side of each coin. 100% cast in a mold. |
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
2887 Posts |
Quote:
This, and the dead giveaway is the extra material rising up around the rims on one side of each coin. 100% cast in a mold. That's how the blanks were made at this time - rather poorly refined silver too - so issues about porosity and rim ridges don't really take us any closer to determining if the coin is real or not. There is nothing that jumps out at me to say it's not real - from the picture. Many coins of this type from this era exibit similar characteristics. But I do agree that it needs to be viewed in -hand to make the call. Edited by Bacchus2
12/30/2013 03:19 am
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Moderator
 Australia
16844 Posts |
Quote:
The porous spots on the edge of each one is what I am worried about
This, and the dead giveaway is the extra material rising up around the rims on one side of each coin. 100% cast in a mold.Um, did either of you guys actually look closely at the genuine coins in the links which allranger posted? They both show these exact same features: porosity, and the squeezed-out rim. Those are side-effects of how these coins are made, not signs of counterfeiting. First off, here's exactly what you've got: they both appear to be 5 kurush coins - in which case, they should be about 41mm across. The 2½ kurush coin has almost exactly the same design, but the rims aren't quite as wide and the coin is only 35mm across. The top one in both sets of pictures (the one with the large triangular piece missing out of it) is dated accession 1223, regnal year 8; the bottom one is dated 1223 regnal 5. This is written 1223//8 and 1223//5 in the catalogues. These dates convert to AD 1815 and 1812. Here is the Krause catalogue data, as transcribed into the NGC database. As you can see, the Year 8 coin is slightly more valuable, though yours will not be because of the missing piece. The 2½ kurush coin is scarcer and more valuable. Finally, the question of authenticity. They appear to be real to me, though as others have said, they can make fakes of anything in the Middle East. Since 1983, the law in Turkey has stated that anything older than 1923 is considered an antiquity, and cannot be bought, sold or exported without a license. On the other hand, making selling and exporting fake antiquities is perfectly legal. Your "coin dealer", if he was selling genuine coins to tourists and operating legally, should have given you a piece of paper explaining to both you and the Turkish Customs agents that these coins (a) are genuine antiquities and (b) are permitted to leave the country. If that didn't happen, then your coins either (a) are fake, or (b) were illegally smuggled out of Turkey. Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
856 Posts |
Hmm... they have some of the characteristics of hammered (ie hand struck) coins, but these aren't coins I know. Looks like they have been cleaned which doesn't help. There are dealers that specialise in Islamic coins. I doubt anyone will give a definitive answer on the basis of a photograph, but if these are from a series of known copies they might confirm that much. Maybe try a search? Alternatively, I've never dealt with this guy but found his site a while back. Maybe see if he'll give an opinion? http://www.wilkescoins.com/ |
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Replies: 25 / Views: 3,024 |
Posted 12/29/2013 8:25 pm
