Heads Up Another Load Of Fakes On Ebay

Numismatic forgery is not limited to China. Having worked for ebay for 14 months as an authenticator, I know very well that China is only one of several areas where forgery is undertaken. China is however one of the few countries in the world allows forgers to operate lawful businesses.

The seller involved in this post claims to be in China and I recognize several of his coins by the dies and I know with 100% certainty that they are manufactured in China. I also know from reviewing over 50,000 auctions in my time with ebay that China accounts for more than HALF of all numismatic forgeries posted on ebay. If you include in this tally the re-sales of Chinese products, the number is much higher. I did make copies of all my reviews and kept my own records in addition to ebay so my claims are accurate.

I will add one other thing that the largest organized ring of sellers of numismatic forgeries by far was located in China operating legally under Chinese Laws but routinely violating US law and there is nothing that US officials can do about it.

In one case, I had attributed 120 individual ID names as being related to a single entity that funneled money back to Beijing. This same group was also proven to have stolen bank account information in Canada and the US to set up fake PayPal identities to funnel money back to China.

There was however, no legal recourse to follow.

I am about 99% sure, based on the precise coins this fellow is selling, that he is part of the same ring of forgers I was tracking late last year. As a group they are making over $50,000 a week off the gullibility of novice collectors. Don't kid yourself about the danger of China to the numismatic market.

I advise everyone to be cautious with all ebay sales but even more so if the coin comes from China and is priced VERY low in todays market. There are no bargains of this magnitude on ebay or anywhere else.

Of course. It takes almost as long to arrive to the buyer as the return policy. At least Paypal's got a 45-180 day refund policy (I don't know anymore what it is, if the 180 day went through or not). Poor, poor, people.

<--- Got duped a year ago from China. Paypal refunded me. Reported everything the seller had every day for two weeks. ebay cancelled his account. He probably restarted one, but I don't care...no one dupes me and gets away with it.

Lesson learned: stay away from China. And yes, gxseries, you can discriminate a seller based on his location when over half the sellers from China are selling forgeries as well that they're sold on alibaba (a Chinese owned company). If half the sellers in America were selling counterfeits, and we had a massive company selling counterfeit goods, do you not think people would stay away?

Having lived in China, I would really not buy coins worth anything from there. I've played the game of going to sellers and trying to tell them that their coins are clearly fake and they will deny it.

Their attitude is, if you can't have the real thing, then go for a fake one that costs lots less. They don't see this as forgery. However they're also interested in making quick money, I've never seen any other country so blatant in their desire to make money over anything else in the world.

So, for these reasons I didn't buy old Chinese coins much. Unless you really are a massive expert and can know for certain something from China is not a fake, I would not even bother.

You are not getting my point. If you need to rely on seller's country of origin to make a judgement, you might as well collect counterfeits. The key to fighting counterfeits is to learn the key features of a genuine coin and what a counterfeit may look like. If you struggle or have doubts, rely on the experts and don't whinge about the prices you pay for their services. If they make a mistake, they should accept the suspected coins back for full refund. Or one can seek advise here - super counterfeits could be a serious problem.

Generic statements such as avoid items in China, magnetic test etc are not helpful these days. Sure - general comments will help stamp out the older lower grade counterfeits but not some of the better quality counterfeits being churned out right now. This is 2014, not 1990s where information flow freely. Counterfeiters use forums like this as cheap and free feedback to find out what went wrong with their operation and correct their flaws, allowing them to continue producing better quality counterfeit, making life harder for everyone.

For quality reading examples, I urge you to check these articles written by Jay Turner. I personally find the Cuban silver peso to be disturbing. This is the kind of stuff that we should be discussing behind the back of counterfeiters. Omega gold and micro O counterfeiters are also another two good examples.

https://registry.ngccoin.hk/news/ar...-gold-mohur/

https://registry.ngccoin.hk/news/ar...silver-peso/

https://registry.ngccoin.hk/news/ar...%C2%BD-pond/

https://registry.ngccoin.hk/news/ar...-1937-chiao/

This reminds me when I put together a fine collection of West Indies regal pieces. I spent almost a year JUST forming my WI library and then started SLOWLY buying the pieces plate matching to Pridmore and major auction sales like from respectable houses like Baldwins. A fake will sell for $20 and a real once can be $500-up. It will STRIP & KILL you if not up to speed.
These China pieces are getting tough and are imposing a similar challenge ... I can spot them ... but they are really hurting the collectors that enjoy contemporary counterfeits of the period as association pieces in their collections like Type 1 CC8Rs from the Gurney Book. What can we do if China officials say its LEGAL!

INCREDIBLE!

John Lorenzo
United States
Numismatist