I'm Almost Speechless On This One.....

Here's an exercise: make a list of uses for the items in that listing.

You see it as insults, I see it as speaking the truth. I honestly don't see how the intent of this listing could have been missed, unless there was a pre-disposition to want to disagree with me.

Let the staff handle it as they see fit. If they think I've personally attacked someone, they can suspend or boot me. I'll still continue to do what I'm doing, trying and make ebay safer for you all, with or without anyone's help here. But thank you to all who have helped.

You shouldn't have a problem with the seller, just the system used to grade coins. Simply put, NGC should do better to protect its name. For instance, if I peel the inspection sticker off of my car, it gets defaced in the process. Why can't NGC do that? Maybe the real question here is why anyone would buy a certified coin if things like this can happen.

If this guy sent these coins back for re-certification, why shouldn't he be able to sell his trash?

So what you're saying, snowman, is that if you drive your car into a tree, then it's the auto manufacturer's fault for making a car that drives into a tree? Or is it God's fault for putting the tree in the path of your car?

Well I don't know about everyone else ,,but I have made a list of the seller and anyone who has bid on this auction ,,they will never see any of my business ,,at least if they use those user names .

The number of bogus slabs which can and eventually will be put in the market affect each and every collector ,,it changes the dynamic of the pop reports , and thus the value collect-ability of those coins .

those who would sell or buy or condone the selling or purchase of items like this have my dis respect .

Metalman

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So what you're saying, snowman, is that if you drive your car into a tree, then it's the auto manufacturer's fault for making a car that drives into a tree? Or is it God's fault for putting the tree in the path of your car?

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Actually it would be your fault for driving into the tree. Just like it would be your fault for buying an easily altered slab. If you want an apt analogy, then how about using an online bank with no security encryption. For the premium their coins demand, NGC could do more for their consumer base by using a more technologically advanced slab.

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So the best way to stop people from buying slabbed coins would be to encourage--or at least turn a blind eye to--sales of the inserts? Very Machiavellian. If my parents hadn't drilled in that old 'two wrongs don't make a right' thing, I might appreciate your point more.

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Who said anything about stopping people from buying slabbed coins? My point is that NGC provides a service. If they can't protect the integrity of their product, then why do business with them? This auction demonstrates an inherent flaw in the current system. The onus is on NGC to fix it. When TJ Max lost customer information did people blame the thieves for stealing it or the company for leaving the door open?

After thinking about the ramifications of this auction and being educated by fellow CCF members, I now am really amazed this auction can be allowed to continue. It would be terrible for the hobby for these holders to go to a buyer.

I will send them a note about this issue and see what they say. If they respond I will report back what they say.

As for NGC doing a better job with security, I think they could to a point. But there will always be people who try to thwart the slabs. As an example, despite all the high-profile efforts of the US govt over the last 5-10 years to produce counterfeit-proof $100, $20, and $10 bills, counterfeiting is more prevalent than ever- $64.9 million counterfeited last year alone (Source: Feb. 2008 Popular Science, p52). Over half of counterfeiting is done with laser scanners and printers. In fact, from 1997 to 2007, counterfeit bills has DOUBLED! 75% of the bills are $100 bills. So while NGC does bear some responsibility to make their labels and slabs more difficult to break open and re-use, there will always be someone who has the drive and motivation to thwart those efforts.

To scumbuster: no hard feelings. I do not have a predisposition to argue. Not everyone has to agree here. Variety is the spice of life! I only responded to what I thought was your request for opinions on the auction. I initially responded to what I thought was a question about them trying to deceive the buyer into thinking they were getting coins with the holders. It did not sink in about the holders themselves being used for wrongful purposes until later.