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 Replies: 26 / Views: 5,284 |
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New Member
Canada
27 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
Okay so I'll admit my scepticism. A friend who works for RBC is able to determine the dotless quantity is 5% of 5million? That's impossible, plus they're still in the process of being released.
I wonder if those dots could be filed off with a dremel or pen sander.
Besides that, why a consistent grease filed die error only in the one location?
Seems somewhat contrived to me..
Edited by wildflowerAB
11/22/2016 5:08 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4867 Posts |
Very interesting. I am in agreement with wildflowerAB.
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Forum Dad
 United States
24150 Posts |
Could die polishing do that?
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
9862 Posts |
The dots are on a high portion of the coin thus they are incuse on the die,well below the field and below the rest of the lever, since die polishing is a top down process on the die the rest of the lever would disappear before the dots.
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning...
-from PCGS website
Edited by DBM
11/22/2016 6:59 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:
Could die polishing do that?
DBM, your observation is better than mine. It's that 5% certainty that makes the entire listing somewhat questionable, in my opinion. Seller appears far too overly confident in providing absolute confirmation that this is a rare variety. Edited by wildflowerAB
11/22/2016 7:04 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1463 Posts |
Not sure why some here thinks there's some sort of hijinx at work. 2 new commem toons for 10$? Buying something online I'd think people would pay 5$ each anyways? Otherwise not much use in selling after fees etc.
I don't know, looks like a light strike to me? Not exciting to me but some might think so, guess we'll see
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Moderator
Canada
10456 Posts |
Quote:
Could die polishing do that? Absolutely not. A clogged die however, could, but it seems more than coincidence that all four of those devices would be clogged on the die. Alternatively, overpolishing of one of the Master Dies (used to create the working dies) could do that... "Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert OppenheimerContent of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_USMy eBay store
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
9862 Posts |
It's 2016, there are no Master Dies, punches are no longer created by hubbing in master dies, they are produced by CNC tools as required. With a mintage of only five million the mint would expect to use about a dozen dies but there is a significant probability that the job could be done with just two dies. I wonder if for low mintages such as this no punches are made but rather dies are produced directly by CNC tools as needed and this error is the result of one such die that was less than perfect.
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning...
-from PCGS website
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3234 Posts |
Looking at the right bottom pic, you can see more missing details to the right of that red oval.
More dots missing and the bar is not as well defined as the left pic is.
It would be nice to examine the complete surface and compare the two again.
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Moderator
Canada
10456 Posts |
Quote:
It's 2016, there are no Master Dies, punches are no longer created by hubbing in master dies, they are produced by CNC tools as required. You say with an air of authority that almost makes it believable. They still produce working dies the same way, the only major difference is in the design process now, using a computer screen and stylus with ArtCAM digital modelling software, instead of plaster disks. This is from the Royal Canadian Mint website (accessed today): Quote:
Die making
Dies used to strike coins are copied from the reduced original design. A second reducing machine takes the brass plate and shrinks all of the information onto a steel die called the matrix, technically the original die. This can take up to 48 hours, after which the matrix is copied to produce the master punch, a process called hobbing.
The master punch is then hobbed onto another blank die to produce working dies, which are used in presses to make coins. "Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert OppenheimerContent of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_USMy eBay store
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Valued Member
Canada
219 Posts |
What about a weak strike? Would it affect the details this way?
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New Member
 Canada
27 Posts |
@numidan
It could be a weak strike. IMHO, it shouldn't be a hijinx work, as they are just too tiny to polish without damaging the others. It's just not worth the fine work for a few bucks.
Anyways, there was a sale for 2 sets already this morning though.
Edited by VanCanCollections
11/23/2016 5:05 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4233 Posts |
I think weak strike as well. Look how flat the other rivets are to the upper left in the right image compared with the round ones on the left image. It reminds me of the flatness of parts of the shield on the reverse of a 1948 half.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
9862 Posts |
@ SPP when I went to the Mint in Ottawa I asked during the tour if dies were made from a master die and if reducing machines were still used, the guide was not sure so she arranged for me to speak with someone else at the end of the tour. That is when I was told that the hubs were created directly from design by CNC tools. Like other info on the Mint's site the se3ction on die making is probably outdated.
With the number of NCLT issues and fairly low mintages of each someone should be canned if they don't have direct design to die capability in 2016.
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning...
-from PCGS website
Edited by DBM
11/24/2016 11:03 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4233 Posts |
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Replies: 26 / Views: 5,284 |
Posted 11/22/2016 6:27 pm
