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Coolest Backdoor Jobs - Canada 25c 1969 Struck On 1967 Gold Sovereign

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Pillar of the Community

Canada
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 Posted 01/03/2017  11:25 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add canadian-varieties to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
It sold for $21,150US on Heritage Auctions in Jan.2014.

I was the runner-up and I still think this was the coolest error coin / backdoor job I'd ever seen.

Coolest-Backdoor-Jobs---Canada-25c-1969-Struck-On-1967-Gold-Sovereign
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Canada
1442 Posts
 Posted 01/03/2017  11:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add canadian-varieties to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Mike Byers has a Canada 25c 1969 struck on 1963 gold sovereign for a cool $30,000 US

Coolest-Backdoor-Jobs---Canada-25c-1969-Struck-On-1967-Gold-Sovereign
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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 01/03/2017  11:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you like these two, the Manitoba gold piece even looks better
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sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21788 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  02:20 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Mint sport.
If the mint employee had been found out, he would have been prosecuted.
Huge temptation for the employee to smuggle it out of the Mint, and sell it for a motza.

If Heritage or PCGS had it, the moral thing to do would have been to report it, and then let the lawyers figure it out, to their profit instead.

That happened with the 1933 Double Eagle.
Edited by sel_69l
01/04/2017 02:21 am
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RoyCoinBoy's Avatar
United States
1609 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  07:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add RoyCoinBoy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Someone over here in the US somehow managed to get a Rosie dime struck onto a nail. Yes, a NAIL.
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Canada
2845 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  09:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very unusual, a quirky twist, too bad the story behind it is unknown.

Remnants of the 1967 British gold sovereign can indeed be observed.
The 25c is dated 1969 or 2 years later.

Would this suggest in 1969 someone included a gold sovereign amongst standard planchets while Cdn 25c were being minted?

50 years later it's easy to assume all kinds of skullduggery occurred but in an era when policies and standards were certainly not ruling the day in the way they do now and the price of gold was insignificant - might it be possible that an innocent tourist from U.K. who was touring the mint have been involved?
Edited by wildflowerAB
01/04/2017 09:17 am
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Canada
1984 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  09:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Smallcentguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There are probably hundreds of 1969 cents out there which are rotated in collar or flipped before a second strike occurred. There are also cents struck on dimes, nickel dollars on silver planchets and probably a few others as well. The mint employees were obviously not well supervised.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Canada-1C-D...AOSwVL1V~Ebf

http://www.ebay.com/itm/XMAS-SALE-C...AOSwHMJYP1V1
Edited by Smallcentguy
01/04/2017 09:18 am
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Biedercoins's Avatar
United States
1602 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  09:21 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Biedercoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


Quote:
might it be possible that an innocent tourist from U.K. who was touring the mint have been involved?


Innocent? Seriously?

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Canada
2845 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  09:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:

Innocent? Seriously?



In the 60s and 70s times were..well different, also prior to labour policies. Look back at the price of gold, it was just a different metal. I'm betting this would been a novelty item at the time, just my opinion.
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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  10:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
As we have seen with the gold puck trial, and the novel defence put on by the accused of the RCM basically allowing him to steal the pucks, the alarm did it's job, sent to hand wand still the alarm goes off and they let him leave, that's with today's tight security measures. I would not be surprised if the UK gold coin was a commissioned piece by a high RCM bigwig or simply a trial piece that an employee took home afterwards
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Canada
2845 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  11:37 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not trying to defend RCM but in the '60s who would have known Gold wasn't about to skyrocket in value.

The best example I can think of is looking back at the two 1967 Special Edition Sets.

$12 for the one with the silver medallion.

The one with the gold coin instead cost a heft $40. But as th gold coin had a face value of $20 and the medallion didn't have any, one could say the difference in cost was only $8, not $28.

Imagine how that would play out today, if RCM offered two coin sets for sale, one with an added 1/2 ounce gold coin for less than the price of all the silver coins added together.
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Pacificoin's Avatar
Canada
5402 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  11:47 am  Show Profile   Check Pacificoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Pacificoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In my opinion the quarters on Gold sovereigns , and all the other fantasy garbage from this 1967 to 1971 period is a total joke and is a small microcosm of how inept or corrupt the management and/ or the employees of the Ottawa Mint were during this period. I would not touch any of it with a ten foot pole. PCGS and others should be ashamed of themselves for perpetuating this material.
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moxking's Avatar
United States
17900 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  1:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add moxking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Since we can only speculate on how these oddities came to be, I don't think I'd be too quick to make a moral judgment.

Would you melt all the 1804 dollars and 1913 nickels?
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Pacificoin's Avatar
Canada
5402 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  5:34 pm  Show Profile   Check Pacificoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Pacificoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@ moxking .......you are kidding right? Comparing obvious fabricated RCM mint sport to a restrike of a classic US silver dollar. I will give you the 1913 Liberty nickels.
There is very little speculation on how a sovereign or a German 20 Mark magically turns into a Gold Canadian 25 cents. Here's how that worked...... mint employee went to local Bank of Nova Scotia in Ottawa , where you could buy any Gold coin you wanted as Canadians could legally buy and sell all they wanted. Reports to work on the late shift strikes a few here and there and oh my , they suddenly end up in the hands of one of the three or four major coin dealers in Canada at the time.
All the back door stuff from the late 1960s, early 1970s always came from the same three or four sources without exception.
Edited by Pacificoin
01/04/2017 5:35 pm
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trout1105's Avatar
Australia
7096 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2017  5:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add trout1105 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
In my opinion the quarters on Gold sovereigns , and all the other fantasy garbage from this 1967 to 1971 period is a total joke and is a small microcosm of how inept or corrupt the management and/ or the employees of the Ottawa Mint were during this period. I would not touch any of it with a ten foot pole. PCGS and others should be ashamed of themselves for perpetuating this material.



The same goes for all the Mint Sport rubbish coming out of the Australian and US mints that is surfacing lately.
These are most definitely NOT genuine errors and those dealing in them should be charged with fraud or for "fencing" stolen property
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Canada
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 Posted 01/04/2017  6:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:


All the back door stuff from the late 1960s, early 1970s always came from the same three or four sources without exception.


Up until the early 70s the mint accepted custom orders including for example, Specimen Sets that were not offered for sale to the general public. It appears little or no records were kept in terms of mintage. I'd presume the majority were ordered by dealers for their customers.

Just curious, would you consider that a type of backdoor sale as well?
Edited by wildflowerAB
01/04/2017 6:12 pm
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