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 Replies: 17 / Views: 3,369 |
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Valued Member
Canada
170 Posts |
Got this today looking for some advice on possible grade and value. Should I send it off for grading or is it worth it?   Edited by redlee
06/13/2017 2:30 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
683 Posts |
Around EF-40 in My opinion, but I'm a little unsure of its authenticity.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
683 Posts |
Then again I'm usually a nervous Nancy when it comes to some coins, best wait for someone who's a bit more knowledgeable.
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Valued Member
Canada
395 Posts |
It's a fake. Can't really see the obverse with that picture but the reverse is clearly of the wrong type and should not appear on an 1889. Sorry
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
9865 Posts |
It's a Chinese counterfeit.
1889 should have 22 leaves on reverse not 21 like yours.
Where did you get it?
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning...
-from PCGS website
Edited by DBM
06/13/2017 4:28 pm
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Valued Member
 Canada
170 Posts |
Bought at an Auction, I asked that question at the auction house, that if its deemed fake do I have recourse and I was ensured that if it were I can return it for a full refund.
Can anyone in the Edmonton area look at this and tell me for sure?
Thanks
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
9865 Posts |
We are telling you for sure, simply count the reverse leaves.
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning...
-from PCGS website
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3733 Posts |
if it were real it would be worth over 3,000$. what price did you win it for at auction.?
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Valued Member
Canada
395 Posts |
No need for someone else to look at it redlee it is 100% fake there is no such thing as a 21 leaf 1889. Looks like a type 1 reverse when it should type 6. Any 10 cent before 1882 has 21 leaves any after or including 1882 should be 22 leaves. You should return it immediately and make sure they destroy the coin.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
9865 Posts |
You should call the RCMP. Auctioneers are supposed to be professional and have a duty to be sure that what they sell is legal.
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning...
-from PCGS website
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4233 Posts |
Help me understand how somebody counterfeits the reverse on this and gets the number of leaves wrong. Take a 21 leaf reverse and change the date? Seems like they usually just make a die or mold off an actual coin.
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Valued Member
Canada
395 Posts |
From what I understand kbbpll they generally do it with a very HD picture and scrub the date and then change the date to whatever they're looking to make. So to them they think that all Victorian dimes are the exact same, they are not coin collectors. In this case it was probably a picture of a very high grade 1870 dime which is much easier to obtain and then they scrubbed the date and put in 1889. This is why the date is sometimes a good indicator as they screw up the font or the spacing of it. Lately as they get better with counterfeits die pairings really do help out spotting a fake quickly although there are obviously many other signs as well.
Redlee you should have insisted that they had it destroyed, fakes like that are illegal in Canada to buy/sell even own although the law is not heavily enforced. Less experienced collectors can easily be taken for alot of money and deter them from collecting further when they realize they were taken. Plus you never know if this is there plan that they keep selling them then refund when someone finds out it's fake and the ones that don't find out is all profit for them.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
9865 Posts |
The Chinese counterfeiters started off with a genuine Victorian 10cent most likely 1874H because they are relatively low priced.
A master "die" is made from this coin using EDM (google "spark erosion coin dies" as I'm not about to explain this process here)
The coin is damaged by the process and can be used only once to create the die, to recreate all the dates in the series faithfully tens of thousands of dollars worth of genuine coins would have to be destroyed. So to avoid this expense the counterfeiters make all dates from the one low cost original. Punches are made from the "master" and the last two digits of the date are ground off all of them and the mint mark as well on some of them. The punches are then used to create production dies in which the last two digits are punched by hand, and thus every date is faked.
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning...
-from PCGS website
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Valued Member
Canada
170 Posts |
Alls good, got a full refund from the Auction House.
Thanks for all the responses and advice.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3234 Posts |
Glad that you did get this 89 posted over here in the right forum.
These guys do know their coins..especially when it comes to many of the fakes..
A bit of trouble..but the refund is there..
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Bedrock of the Community
Canada
10743 Posts |
Can you mention the auction house?
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Replies: 17 / Views: 3,369 |
Posted 06/13/2017 4:02 pm
