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2004 P Wisconsin Quarter With Extra Leaf

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 Posted 01/27/2018  10:33 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add JJFlash to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I have seen the postings for the Wisconsin quarter with the extra leaf but I believe they have all been for the Denver mint. Since this quarter is from the Philadelphia mint, I am suspicious of its authenticity. Are there instances of this error from both mints?
2004-P-Wisconsin-Quarter-With-Extra-Leaf
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Jim0815's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2018  11:06 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jim0815 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to the CCF! Nice find!
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coop's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2018  11:09 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wexler lists not DDRs on the leaves for this mint/State. But lists a doubling on the nose area:
http://doubleddie.com/190932.html
You might want to see what areas this is happening? (news to me also)
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Chase007's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2018  11:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chase007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


Can't quite make out from this Pic. Can't quite tell if it is a DD or water mark!
Can you post a larger close up of the area in question.
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coop's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2018  11:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Check the link I posted Chase007.
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 Posted 01/27/2018  11:38 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chase007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Check the link I posted Chase007.


Thanks Coop, I am somewhat familiar with this variety and as you mentioned all DD listings for the Philly mints are on the Nose area.
I believe OP is asking if his/her coin has an Extra Leaf.
Edited by Chase007
01/27/2018 11:39 am
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 Posted 01/27/2018  12:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Which I also mentioned in my post. The story I heard was someone at the Denver mint altered the dies to make these marks. So it is reasonable, that just the Denver dies are affected. Must have been in the die making shop, as the die would have to be heated to soften it or was altered before it was hardened. Thus the dies made a full run on these dies. (the idea that there were altered is that there is no normal reason for the dies to have these lines as they do not follow any design of the hub. So need to look for DDRs on other mints dies. Just this mints dies were altered) A second point is that the areas affected are on the outer part of the die. (CLASS 9 Doubled dies) The single squeeze dies are less often to affected with doubled dies on the reverse die areas. (CLASS 4 + 8 do affect some outer devices) Most of the single squeeze dies affect the central areas of the dies. The snap back into correct alignment usually does not alter the further devices as the design is usually correct by the hubbing, just not as often as the central area would be left altered. On the obverse devices, you see the hubbing that distorts the devices more often than on the reverse single squeeze die patterns. Why?
Edited by coop
01/27/2018 12:34 pm
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 Posted 01/27/2018  2:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chase007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Coop,Once again thanks for the valuable information.


Quote:
you see the hubbing that distorts the devices more often than on the reverse single squeeze die patterns. Why?


I have been wanting to know the answer for as long as I remember!
Edited by Chase007
01/27/2018 2:30 pm
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 Posted 01/27/2018  11:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fortcollins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Totally useless and only slightly off topic trivia time . . .

On the Denver mint high and low leaf varieties:

In FY 2008, the United States Department of the Treasury Office of Inspector General investigated the events related to the high leaf variety. OIG issued a report stating that the high leaf variety was caused by an "element of the production outside of human control," and ruled out a clashed die as a possibility. The report suggested that a press operator noticed the problem, shut down the press and then promptly went to lunch for an hour and a half. The press then supposedly was restarted by some unknown person while he was at lunch, and somewhere around 35,000 to 50,000 coins were produced and bagged for shipment before he returned from lunch.

The OIG explanation sounds like a baloney sandwich, but that's the official version of the high leaf quarter. As a side note, a couple years after the Wisconsin quarter fiasco, Denver acknowledged minting about 750 quarters per minute per press. At that rate, an hour and a half lunch would have resulted in 67,500 quarters.

I'm not aware of any explanation for the low leaf quarter.
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