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1925 Australian Penny - Scarce? Not Any More.

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Valued Member
squaremealroundplate's Avatar
Australia
185 Posts
 Posted 02/18/2018  3:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add squaremealroundplate to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Hello all

I've just sent a message to the seller of that $620 - plus $7.90 for registered postage - 1925 Penny sold 15.1.2018 congratulating " it " on the " magnificent " range of very good replicas " it " has available, AND the very good replicas " it " has sold with the assistance of known dual ID " friends "
That 1925 Penny : - how on earth could anyone NOT see the different style of the date's details to start with, and the obvious overseas work of the Penny ?

But, then again, there are numbskull wood ducks out there who are easily mislead by the unnatural blinding glare from the coin(s) being offered.

Still, fools and their money are soon parted.
Valued Member
CoinOS's Avatar
269 Posts
 Posted 02/18/2018  4:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinOS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
That 1925 Penny : - how on earth could anyone NOT see the different style of the date's details to start with, and the obvious overseas work of the Penny ?


Good Q.

That particular seller is a twit. He or she thinks they can hide their selling history on ebay, fortunately for us that is impossible.

The item you mention 263428649653 is clearly a modern reproduction and it boggles the mind as to why anyone would part with that much money on a hope and prayer.

He's on the radar and so are his shill accounts. If he tries his luck again with the same coin, the auction will be cancelled.

Most of his current auctions are fake rubbish.


Quote:
fools and their money are soon parted.


That phrase comes from Defence of the Government of the Church of England, 1587: John Bridges

"If they pay a penie or two pence more for the reddinesse of them..let them looke to that, a foole and his money is soone parted. "

In our society there are people vulnerable to scams, be it ebay or a Nigerian billionaire or a Russian wife, or an Indian virus quickfix .. many people are easily parted with money under false pretense.
The fact is it happens everywhere - even in the local supermarket and every shop in the mall, but that is simply the advertising game and it's a complex issue. Personal preference is nothing more than freedom in disguise.

Are these people stupid? Compared to Einstein - yes. I would not be too harsh as I don't really understand it, all I can do is form a posse online and try to put a squeeze on the more obvious scammers.

Serious collectors typically invest not only their money, but many thousands of hours reading and learning. It does pay off.

Cheers & have a great day.
Edited by CoinOS
02/19/2018 02:07 am
Pillar of the Community
Australia
852 Posts
 Posted 02/19/2018  02:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nealeffendi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
CoinOS, I respectfully have to disagree with you about it being OK to buy a copy coin. With almost 100% certainty the manufacturers of copy coins don't have the noble standards that ethical sellers have. They will use the money they make from selling copies to finance and perfect their product until they can produce fakes that cannot be picked from the genuine and then sell them to dupes. I'm not going to finance crooks that will kill this hobby.
Valued Member
CoinOS's Avatar
269 Posts
 Posted 02/19/2018  06:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinOS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I see your point and it's not entirely without merit.

However, I do not believe that they are really trying to fool anyone, their copies are always poor [with a few rare exceptions] and they always identify them as copies or tokens.

What the Chinese are doing is wrong, no argument. So is what my power company is doing.
The coins are there and they are not going anywhere - buying a few trinkets is harmless.

I am angry at Australians selling stuff deceitfully and my sight is squarely aimed at them, not the Chinese.


Quote:
They will use the money they make from selling copies to finance and perfect their product until they can produce fakes that cannot be picked from the genuine


No. They will likely use it to buy rice.

I have been doing business with China for 15 years and have a very long list of Chinese contacts.
They are impecunious on a good day and hungry on others.

If they were trying to perfect coin forgery they have had centuries to do it. Even Australian pre-decimal coins have a long history of being made in China. The well known case of Kwong Tseng back in the 1932 depression springs to mind.

https://www.australian-coins.com/co...r-shillings/

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/...cle/16932392


Quote:
I'm not going to finance crooks that will kill this hobby.


Good.


Edited by CoinOS
02/19/2018 10:36 am
Valued Member
squaremealroundplate's Avatar
Australia
185 Posts
 Posted 02/19/2018  09:38 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add squaremealroundplate to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

We'll as far as my understanding of business goes, is if people become aware, or begin to suspect, that the " "goods " anyone is selling isn't " Kosher ", or is in some way of doubtful quality, and/or authenticity, then they will stop buying that/those "goods". Word gets around quickly when people start realising that they are getting duped.

Businesses selling the doubtful quality and/or authenticity " goods " will go out of business quickly.

It doesn't matter at all whatsoever where the " goods " of doubtful quality and/or authenticity come from, because it is consumer sovereignty which determines what, how many and for what price goods are purchased.

It's simple, really. If dodgy dishonest sellers are named, and people stop buying their " goods ", then what would be the point of those dodgy seller(s) continuing to import " goods " that are of doubtful quality and/or authenticity? These dodgy seller(s) might still be a little human, and not want to be caught with a lot of unsaleable " goods " and lose a lot of money. (although them losing a lot of money, instead of only all those they deliberately deceived, would be pure justice )


nealeffendi

it appears as though you're well versed in things going on. However, it matters not one iota where the " goods " come from, nor what the producers of the doubtful quality and/or authenticity " goods " might or might not do with the procedes of the " goods " they produce. If there isn't a market for what they produce they stop producing.

If consumers can be readily made aware, or warned, that X seller(s) are dodgy, then if the consumer(s) who become fully aware that the X seller(s) are deceptive cheats ( gaining property ($'s ) by deception, knowingly importing with the intention of deceiving via an electronic medium, portraying counterfeit Crown currency via electronic medium in photographs, as genuine with the intention to deceive, etc, ) , then, and only then can we, as potentially affected Australians,- united in our quest - can begin to completely stamp out this rapidly growing scurge.

We can just keep on writing about this dodgy seller or those " artistic and creative " Chinese until we're blue in the face, or our fingers start becoming stubs from all the keyboard writing ; If something doesn't sell, then there isn't a market for it, so what's the point of producing it ?

In other words - and you can disagree with what I've written - if the dodgy seller(s) cannot sell their " fractured " overseas made imported " goods " , they get caught with a lot of their unsold " fractured " "goods ", and, like the
consumers they deceptively sold many " fractured " " goods " to, they will also lose a great deal of money.
So, are we going to just keep making each other aware of this and that dodgy eller, or, are we going to start naming and shaming ?

The ball is in OUR court .
Valued Member
CoinOS's Avatar
269 Posts
 Posted 02/19/2018  10:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinOS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
sent a message to the seller of that $620 - plus $7.90 for registered postage - 1925 Penny


Any reply from him?

Edited by CoinOS
02/19/2018 8:17 pm
Pillar of the Community
Basil's Avatar
Australia
1040 Posts
 Posted 02/19/2018  5:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Basil to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
CoinOS, I respectfully have to disagree with you about it being OK to buy a copy coin.


SMRP..i have to agree with NeaL on this one,as I posted before its getting to the stage on ebay where its risky to buy a raw Coin.
It will probably get worse before its gets better,allowing fake anything to flood a market only ends up in tears for all parties.
Its time ebay banned all replica/fake Coins & Notes and the people selling them.
Valued Member
CoinOS's Avatar
269 Posts
 Posted 02/19/2018  8:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinOS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Its time ebay banned all replica/fake Coins & Notes and the people selling them.


Some Chinese sellers are being responsibly proactive as this image shows:

1925-Australian-Penny---Scarce?--Not-Any-More.

Maybe all of them should be pressured to stamp fake coins like that.

If I did buy a replica coin it would not be from ebay, it would be from the maker overseas and it would be one of super rare 1/2 million dollar coins as a novelty, for harmless fun. Arguments against that are facile & not worth my time.

I have never said here or elsewhere that it's okay to buy a non genuine coin from ebay.

I'd be more than happy for ebay to put an absolute ban on copy coins - and the sooner the better.

Given the dismal quality of ebay Australia overall - it's wishful thinking.


Edited by CoinOS
02/19/2018 11:45 pm
Pillar of the Community
Basil's Avatar
Australia
1040 Posts
 Posted 02/20/2018  12:58 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Basil to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Maybe all of them should be pressured to stamp fake coins like that.


Golfing friend was in Hong Kong about 5 years ago and there were several shops selling Oz.(and other Countries as well)fake Coins,you could buy either one with 'Replica' stamped on or one without,they were both exactly the same Coin.
The same with the Perth Mint Gold bar fakes,the ones that go out the front door have Replica stamped on them,the ones that go out the back door and the vast majority have nothing on them to distinguish them from the real item.
They have the packaging almost perfect with rotating genuine numbers.
Jungle out there.
Edited by Basil
02/20/2018 12:59 am
Pillar of the Community
Australia
3831 Posts
 Posted 02/20/2018  04:30 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gxseries to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This goes both ways. It's just not the dodgy sellers - there are buyers who are willing to throw their money away. And guess what? This is how the vicious cycle continues - there is a market to sell these counterfeits and hence these sellers exist. It's sad to see that these buyers aren't trusting professional dealers / slabs etc and think they've got a steal.

As much as I would like to name and shame sellers - there have been cases where sellers have threatened forums for defaming them even if they are in the wrong. Sadly this has happened and it's not getting any easier.
My partial coin collection http://www.omnicoin.com/collection/gxseries
My numismatics articles and collection: http://www.gxseries.com/numis/numis_index.htm
Regularly updated at least once a month.
Pillar of the Community
Australia
852 Posts
 Posted 02/20/2018  05:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nealeffendi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Basil is correct about the difficulty of buying off ebay (and not just coins but golf clubs and many branded products). So many potential buyers won't bid on coins (that are genuine) because of the risk of fakes. That costs the genuine seller serious money. As I can sometimes spot tiny die markers for genuine coins I have sometimes purchased such genuine coins very cheaply.
Valued Member
CoinOS's Avatar
269 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2018  07:20 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinOS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
As I can sometimes spot tiny die markers for genuine coins


I envy your skills.
Pillar of the Community
paxbrit's Avatar
United States
992 Posts
 Posted 03/01/2018  10:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paxbrit to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You can't cheat an honest man. If the buyers had not talked themselves into believing they had found a jackpot, an expensive coin at a bargain price, they would still have their money in pocket. They got greedy, and taken, as a result.
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