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 Replies: 27 / Views: 6,952 |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1980 Posts |
just wondering approximately how many 1859 brass cents are known?
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1471 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
666 Posts |
PCGS pop report has 9
NGC pop report has 1
ICCS = ?
I thought I read somewhere that there were about 20-30 known. Bosox may have a more accurate #.
Edited by 1960NYGiants
01/28/2021 8:22 pm
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1348 Posts |
Jesse from CCN interviewed me a couple months ago when a new one was found. I opined in the article that over thirty exist. I believe that to be true based on several raw ones (credible sightings) I have heard about. I suspect that as people get more and more coins xrf tested the total may rise above fifty examples.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1618 Posts |
ICCS = 21 (based on the most recent pop report [2016])
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1348 Posts |
Some of the ICCS graded coins now reside in PCGS holders.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1348 Posts |
This thread needs a picture.  http://www.victoriancent.com2011 & 2025 Fred Bowman Award Winner, 2020 J. Douglas Ferguson Award Winner, & 2022 Paul Fiocca Award Winner. Life Member of RCNA.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5585 Posts |
I agree with the "about 20" figure, but who knows. A lot will depend upon a firm decision on how much zinc is required to actually call it brass. The "brass" cents were caused by a mixing problem with the alloy for the planchets. For the March 2012 article in the CN journal, a random assignment of 10% was used to try to define what is/was brass and what wasn't. That 10% is really pushing the envelope since, normally, you would need almost 30% zinc to call something brass, but there are well over 50 different alloys that are, or have been called, brass for specific purposes. Bosox has one and has seen others.I think very few, maybe a handful, may be found in the future.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1984 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5585 Posts |
That does not look like any of the few that I've seen. I would try to contact the auction house or NGC to find out what the XRF showed as far as alloy. That auction coin was struck very very late in the striking year, as evidenced by the size of the vine breaks at 7 & 2.. I hope Bosox chimes in here. I don't believe it. I'm not sire that NGC knows the difference between coinage brass an coinage bronze.
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Moderator
 Canada
10456 Posts |
Colour is not a reliable indicator for the brass 1859 coins. There needs to be no tin, and around 10% zinc.
"Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert OppenheimerContent of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_USMy eBay store
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5585 Posts |
That's it exactly, SPP. I think that I sent you at least 30 '59's that appeared somewhat yellow for the brass article in the CN Journal and none were. I think that you XRF'd about 700 1859's from early, mid, and late struck dies for the article and about 100-150 after just to have a larger sample. Except for Rob's, the others that I've seen are just brown. But even the brass ones have a small amount <1-2% tin, but all have over 10% zinc, some up to 30% zinc.
Edited by okiecoiner
01/30/2021 2:13 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1348 Posts |
I have never seen the XRF results on mine. Chuck Moore told me it was originally in an ANACS holder and he sent it to PCGS. Chuck said they determined the coin was 15 or 16% zinc, hence the very yellow appearance.
I suspect the NGC coin is "brass", i.e. about 10% zinc. It looks dark, but lighting for the photo may be playing tricks. I also agree with SPP, color is not necessary a reliable indicator. These coins are odd ducks. The softer alloy tends to wear quickly at the edges. Also, a few of them I have seen are stained and kind of ugly.
http://www.victoriancent.com2011 & 2025 Fred Bowman Award Winner, 2020 J. Douglas Ferguson Award Winner, & 2022 Paul Fiocca Award Winner. Life Member of RCNA.
Edited by bosox
01/31/2021 05:20 am
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1505 Posts |
Am not sure how much "believing" I should place on this statement made to me by a BC collector:
"I own several of 1859 brass cents".
And NO, I am unable to say who it is.
H
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Moderator
Canada
10456 Posts |
H., it is no secret that G. Urichuk, who sometimes deals under the name 'Collector to Collector' has been hoarding the 1859 brass. He also hoards the 1985 New Zealand mule dollar.
"Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert OppenheimerContent of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_USMy eBay store
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1505 Posts |
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Replies: 27 / Views: 6,952 |
Posted 01/28/2021 8:21 pm
