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 Replies: 24 / Views: 3,774 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1057 Posts |
This was an inexpensive pickup for me about 40 years ago, and I'm no closer now to knowing anything definitive about its attribution than I was at the turn of the century. I confess I haven't looked very hard since about then because I switched the focus of my collection to British tokens, but everything I'd found up until that point seemed to be rumor, speculation, and theory. Nobody could establish a source, issuer or purpose for this piece, and even its association with Canada, much less Anticosti Island, was questionable at best.   I've read all the stories about the wealthy hunting lodge owner on Anticosti, about shipwreck salvage finds, and about South American hacienda tokens, etc., but seriously, have we come any closer to a real attribution for this piece in the last 20 years? Or will it be a maverick forever, stuck in the "Nobody Knows Anything" category? Any and all updates are welcome here! (...as long as you don't mention Roswell.) 
"If everything seems to be under control, you're just not going fast enough."
--- Mario Andretti
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Moderator
 United States
56855 Posts |
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Bedrock of the Community
Canada
21584 Posts |
That seemed easy, there are even two for sale on ebay. |
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5585 Posts |
There have been some discussions about the token on one of the coin sites in the last few months. I thought that it was on here, but the "search" turned up nothing. Maybe manually going through the last couple months will find it. The title may not have been titles "Anticosti" but the discussion went there. I did find a reference on the PCGS site for world coins. Look at June 2020 on the PCGS discussion site since CCF won't allow a link. Here is a great article on the token/island. It's on p6 of their paper: https://www.edmontoncoinclub.com/wp..._May2014.pdfEdited by okiecoiner
08/17/2021 07:35 am
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Valued Member
United States
178 Posts |
I believe the "Anticosti Island" attribution stems back to a listing in an 1890 catalog by the Scott Stamp & Coin Company on the basis of the letter "A", which is questionable at best to say the least... Apart from this, there is zero evidence I'm aware of that ties it to Anticosti Island.
Still no progress since! Although I recall reading somewhere about an alternate theory but I cannot find the article at the moment.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5238 Posts |
Despite that coins and Canada reference, I am in the same camp as the Edmonton Coin Club article: attribution not proven.
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Moderator
Canada
10456 Posts |
Quote:
Despite that coins and Canada reference, I am in the same camp as the Edmonton Coin Club article: attribution not proven. Coins and Canada website, while does have its usefulness for novice collectors, it is not a valid reference. Mark Bink's article (Edmonton Numismatic Society) is numismatic research, and I would put much more value in that as a reference. Even if the origin does become known at some point, Mark's article will likely be cited as an information source. "Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert OppenheimerContent of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_USMy eBay store
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1057 Posts |
So, still nothing conclusive. Bink certainly does a thorough research job (including a review of the literature) and gives us a lot to contemplate, but he ends up with the shipwreck theory, which is basically unsupported by anything beyond conjecture. That could explain how the association with Anticosti *might have* materialized out of thin air in 1890, but I guess we still don't know who issued this piece or where.
I appreciate the input!
The saga continues...
"If everything seems to be under control, you're just not going fast enough."
--- Mario Andretti
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
632 Posts |
I toy with the idea that this is some sort of game token or spielgelt. Just because of design and denomination similarities with some other pieces, issue date, size and metal used plus the fact that some historic characters involved were gamblers - but absolutely NO evidence.
In my opinion, the only certainty is that we will never know.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1923 Posts |
I also am puzzled by this coin with very little hard evidence of where it come from and what it was used for, but when I seen one and had a chance to own one I jumped on it and I'm happy to add it to my collection.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts |
Edited by Wrekkdd
08/22/2021 09:59 am
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5585 Posts |
Again, NGC has depended upon conjecture. It's like getting a definition off of social media and printing it as fact.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts |
Ooo, my apologies I just researched it quick and found that. I guess I should be more aware of where the information is sited from when looking up any website.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
632 Posts |
Since pointed me by another collector, all pieces I ever saw (not that many and most by pictures only) have a 'doubled' 8 (re-entry?) and at least 3 pimples in the obverse planchet.
Mine is an optimistic NGC MS64RB. Not a rare grade but a quite nice coin. I love it
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1057 Posts |
 I'm concurring with everyone so far that conjecture and speculation are still all we have on this "so-called token." I do recall reading somewhere a long time ago that no one's seen examples in the marketplace that show signs of significant circulation, virtually all showing up in EF or better condition, and no reports have surfaced anywhere that it's ever changed hands in commerce...outside of the collecting world we all live in, that is. It pops up in online searches with a citation to a June 2020 Stacks/Bowers sale, where it was listed as "CH-250." Can one of our fellow CCF members out there fill the rest of us in on what Charlton has to say about it, if anything? What got me started looking into this little bit of exonumismalogical mystery? Earlier this year I came across two specimens that changed hands for big bucks (about $500 and $1600) as part of the Heritage Auctions Partrick sales, one in Part 1 and the other in Part 2. I'd forgotten I still had one of my own. Interestingly, HA labeled them "Patterns" with no further attribution or sourcing for that....just adding to the general unfounded and irresponsible rumormongering, in my humble opinion. (Harsh, I know...) Best to all! Tom
"If everything seems to be under control, you're just not going fast enough."
--- Mario Andretti
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Valued Member
Canada
220 Posts |
Quote:
Daltonista: It pops up in online searches with a citation to a June 2020 Stacks/Bowers sale, where it was listed as "CH-250." Can one of our fellow CCF members out there fill the rest of us in on what Charlton has to say about it, if anything? According to some, there are clues pointing to a Honduras origin (Minted by the Paris Mint). But personally, I've never been convinced. And to answer Daltonista, I don't know what the reference is, but it's not from the Charlton catalogs. From memory, I don't think it is listed in any Charlton catalog. And on the CoinsandCanada website, there is a mistake. Since the specifications given are those of the MT-4 token (Breton #567). I'm sorry if my English isn't perfect... I'm learning a little more every day.
Edited by ainsivalavie
09/21/2021 11:31 am
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Replies: 24 / Views: 3,774 |
Posted 08/17/2021 06:50 am
