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 Replies: 18 / Views: 2,775 |
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New Member
Austria
18 Posts |
Hello!  At Sunday, I bought a bag of coins at a garage sale here in Austria for €20. In addition to many modern world coins, the bag contained an old Austrian silver Kreuzer which I didn't have in my collection before. Great deal! However, there was also a 1794 US Liberty Cap large Cent, a coin I never expected in such a situation. So my question: Does the coin look genuine? And what varaint is it? (If anyone can still say that despite the low grade) It would be great if I could add it to my US Type Set. The weight is 12.60g *** Moved by Staff to a more appropriate forum. ***Sorry for my bad English.    Edited by Danlin_26
05/23/2022 4:31 pm
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Moderator
 United States
56855 Posts |
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New Member
 Austria
18 Posts |
@John1 Thanks! |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
94367 Posts |
Very cool, congrats!   to the CCF! |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1308 Posts |
Great find! It looks authentic, but in rough shape.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
579 Posts |
I can't tell which die pair it is, but it looks like a 1794 head of 1793to
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11880 Posts |
In my opinion this coin does not appear to be real. The reason is that normally, in any coin, you see the design elements raised above the fields and as a coin wears down from handling and circulation, the devices and fields wear down. In this coin I see that the fields appear to have risen to the level of the devices and the rims. You see this primarily in the rims in the obverse and more markedly in the raised fields at the center of the reverse. In the obverse, by the lettering BER in LIBERTY, it looks like there are several raised metal bridges to the rims across the lower level, dark fields. It looks like a poorly executed cast copy.
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
579 Posts |
It looks real since the obverse matches one of the die pairs, but can you send an edge photo?
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11880 Posts |
The 1793-95 cent planchet were supposed to weigh 13.48 grams. At 12.6g, this coin has lost ~6.5% of its original weight specification. That is if the planchet wasn't underweight to begin with, and the variance from the target weight was pronounced in 1794 due to crude planchet production and long travel times often from abroad. Add to that that it is possible to lose up to 5% of the weight of the coin to wear, and it looks like the coin could be within normal tolerance although at the extreme tail end on the distribution. The weight of the coin provides an inconclusive avenue of verification.
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7618 Posts |
to the Community! Looks like the real deal to me, but the coin has had a tough life. I'd just add the coin to your collection and enjoy it. No apologies needed regarding your English. Yours is better than many that have lived here all their life!  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3848 Posts |
It looks very real, and in very rough shape. Super coin!!! I would love to have one of these some day.
I've been to countless garage sales and I've never come across anything this neat! Keep hunting, there will always be more treasures out there!
Suffering from bust half fever. Want to learn how to attribute early half dollars by die variety? Click Here: http://goccf.com/t/434955Shoot me a PM if you are looking to sell bust halves. |
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Moderator
United States
188213 Posts |
Nice find! |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
5667 Posts |
It looks authentic, and it might be an S-65. The pattern of denticles on the obverse (strong in lower left, weak in upper right) is consistent with that variety.
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New Member
Austria
18 Posts |
Wow, thanks for all the replies! I think, I will add it to my type set. I took a picture of the edge, it has the normal lettering "One Hundred for a Dollar". Regarding those bright spots over the BER, I honestly don't think they are metal bridges, but instead part of the large worn area that can be seen all the way to the right edge of the obverse.   (Glad that I don't have to be too ashamed of my English.) Edited by Danlin_26
05/24/2022 5:33 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11880 Posts |
That copper looks very orange and shiny. The edges to the face of the coin are square and sharp typical of coins struck in a collar. The edge surface seem really flat and smooth throughout the rounded edge for a coin in this heavily circulated condition that was not struck in a collar. There was a collar that applied the lettering but it was not used when the coin was struck.with the obverse and reverse design. The edge lettering application was a different process that applied lettering, but did not smooth the edge surface.. I would have expected something rougher and more like this in a genuine example. This is a 1794 S-22.  IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.comEdited by numismatic student
05/24/2022 6:17 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5667 Posts |
I'm convinced the coin is genuine. Here is an example of a 1794 S-65 in similar condition (but without the corrosion) that shows the characteristic denticle pattern of this variety; the date and LIBERTY positions match exactly. I think the surfaces are heavily affected by corrosion, not just wear, which may explain why the edges don't look as worn. https://coins.ha.com/itm/large-cent...ToLot-071515 |
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Replies: 18 / Views: 2,775 |
Posted 05/23/2022 5:46 pm
