Doubled Feather Buffalo Nickels: Two 16doubled Die Obverse / DDO Found!!

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mycrob Pillar of the Community United States 2602 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 10:10 am I just completed a search through over 10,000 dateless Philly Buffalo nickels. Only these 9 coins looked interesting. All of them have varying degrees of doubling in one or both feathers, and all of them can be seen with the naked eye without magnification. I blew up the feathers on all of them and also 3 of the coins look very similar to each other in the doubling and have part of the word "unum" backwards & upside down under the neck. Some of the coins also feature doubling in other areas, like neck, eye, nose, hair pony tail. I've labeled them 1 to 9 so you can just say comments about the coin number. The reverses on all of these have no mint mark and there is nothing remarkable. What do you think- is there anything here of interest? Thanks! Image: bufdoubl1.jpg 99.57 KB Image: bufdoubl2.jpg 101.37 KB Image: bufdoubl3.jpg 101.49 KB Image: bufdoubl4.jpg 96.98 KB Image: bufdoubl5.jpg 98.83 KB Image: bufdoubl6.jpg 98.59 KB Image: bufdoubl7.jpg 98.78 KB Image: bufdoubl8.jpg 100.9 KB Image: bufdoubl9.jpg 101.28 KB Edited by mycrob 05/01/2009 1:58 pm Report this Post to the Staff

coppercoins Pillar of the Community United States 7629 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 11:01 am All nine are Machine Doubling. Report this Post to the Staff
mycrob Pillar of the Community United States 2602 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 11:38 am Thought you'd say that... So it's not at all possible that any of these is a DDO? I shake my head in utter disbelief. Report this Post to the Staff
coppercoins Pillar of the Community United States 7629 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 12:19 pm No, it's not possible. Machine Doubling and doubled dies are two completely different things with completely different characteristics. Report this Post to the Staff
coppercoins Pillar of the Community United States 7629 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 12:21 pm I'm not really quite sure where the motivation is to look through 10,000 dateless Buffalo nickels for doubled feathers...unless you happen to be looking for the 1916 DDO. If that's the case, you might as well be checking boxes of pennies for gold coins. The 1916 DDO is super rare. Report this Post to the Staff
coppercoins Pillar of the Community United States 7629 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 12:24 pm Not only that, but looking through coins that might or might not be 1916 nickels even worsen's your chances. Although a vast majority of dateless Buffalo nickels are NOT from 1935-1938, there are still more than 20 years worth of other dates your coins could be. Finding a 1916 doubled die in a pile of 10,000 1916 nickels would be hard enough. Now you multiply your odds by more than 20 by looking through coins for which you don't know the dates. The chance exists that NONE of your 10,000 nickels are from 1916. Report this Post to the Staff
Jazzcoins Valued Member United States 301 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 1:47 pm I don't understand the logic of looking for a doubled die with buffalo's in that condition even if you did find a doubled die the coin would be worth null because IT;s so worn there not desirable-any more even if you do find something on them sorry just my opinion jazzcoins joe Report this Post to the Staff
rockdude Pillar of the Community United States 1807 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 2:32 pm I don't think that a coins value has anything to do with it being collectible. Report this Post to the Staff
mycrob Pillar of the Community United States 2602 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 4:56 pm I don't understand the rationale for you guys to be questioning my motivation for searching through coins. WOW, I am really surprised by that. But here goes. Because it's fun, I enjoy doing it and I may find something cool. If I want to use my time to do it, it shouldn't matter. Chances of finding that really rare coin are very very low, yes I'll admit it. But guess what? I have found many goodies by searching through bulk lots of coins. Eg., I have found 1897 "1 in neck" Indian cents (7!), a 37D 3-legged Buffalo nicklel, a 1972 doubled die obverse cent, a 1894/94 Indian cent, and 1974D DDO JFK halves (3!), and others. HOW? By searching through coins in bulk lots, coins from rolls at the bank, etc. So the hours of enjoyment I get, plus occasionally scoring a good one are my motivation. I love this hobby for the enjoyment of looking at coins and despite the comments above, I will not let my enthusiasm be dampened. And with all due respect to the experts above, I am 99% certain that one of the coins I posted above is a dateless 16/16 DDO. I hope some other experts can come on here and confirm it by saying which picture they think is it. So I respectfully and humbly disagree with the assessment that all of these are Machine Doubling and that it is "not possible" for any of these to be a DDO. I just sent one of the pictures earlier today to ANACS and they responded saying that it looks good as a 16/16 dateless DDO and they will be willing to autheticate it. PM if you don't believe me and I'll send you a copy of the email. This email today from ANACS now has me wondering why all these that I posted are being called Machine Doubling, if one one of them is certainly a DDO? Is it just an honest difference of opinion by different experts? It makes me wonder about how loose the " Machine Doubling" definition is if it can be applied to a coin that is really a DDO. Isn't it at all possible that some of these coins I posted might be newly discovered varieties? Or maybe they are not DDOs but something else that we do not have a name for? And in my extensive experience with Buffalo nickels I am not necessarily searching through 20 years' worth of dateless, because more than 75% of the dateless are teens, based on me restoring dates on hundreds and hundreds of nickels. The teens are much more heavily represented in dateless lots than 20s and 30s. 30s account for less than 5%. I think there would be an interest in dateless DDOs if they are certified. P.S. I am trying to say this with the greatest and utmost respect to the many years of expertise on this thread. I am still learning in this hobby. Report this Post to the Staff
foundinrolls Pillar of the Community United States 3507 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 5:55 pm Hi, I do agree that all of the above nickels exhibit Machine Doubling. That being said, Since they are dateless and they have been looked through once, you might want to go back and look for any that may still have visible words such as LIBERTY or FIVE CENTS. Look for distinct doubling on those words. There may be something in there yet:-) Have Fun, Bill Report this Post to the Staff
weerdsteev Pillar of the Community United States 1291 Posts	Posted 02/12/2009 6:19 pm mycrob - Wow! You go, guy! I, too, was somewhat dismayed at some of the comments you received. When that 4th photo you posted turns out to be a 1916 DDO your sunshine is really gonna spoil their rain! Personally, I think digging through a bucket of well traveled no date Buffaloes, whether you're looking for DDO's, mint marked issues or even those with faint dates is a heck of a lot of fun. Probably more so than going through rolls from a bank looking for some 40% silver coins or an occasional Wheat cent...but that's just me. Report this Post to the Staff
mycrob Pillar of the Community United States 2602 Posts	Posted 02/13/2009 10:08 am It is indeed coin #4 that I think is a dateless 16 DDO and ANACS thinks so as well. Report this Post to the Staff
manila galleon trade Pillar of the Community Spain 1361 Posts	Posted 02/14/2009 05:20 am Keep it up mycrob Report this Post to the Staff
shovel78 Valued Member United States 79 Posts	Posted 02/14/2009 09:59 am I search a lot of rolls and enjoy it. Maybe one of these days I will find a gold nugget. Report this Post to the Staff
foundinrolls Pillar of the Community United States 3507 Posts	Posted 02/14/2009 3:07 pm A closer look and checking other examples, I think you are right! I am sorry that I missed that, but it does indeed seem to have the right diagnostics. I will say That I do think that #4 is a worn example of a 1916 DDO. Report this Post to the Staff
weerdsteev Pillar of the Community United States 1291 Posts	Posted 02/14/2009 7:09 pm I was just re-reading this whole topic and I found this quote: Quote: Finding a 1916 doubled die in a pile of 10,000 1916 nickels would be hard enough. Now you multiply your odds by more than 20 by looking through coins for which you don't know the dates. The chance exists that NONE of your 10,000 nickels are from 1916. coopercoins: Were you being serious? Mintage figures indicate - and my experience (which is pretty sizable, when it comes to DATELESS nickels) is - that the 1916 nickel would be the single most prevalent date in a pile of 10,000 no dates, potentially being outnumbered by only the 1920. I hear what you're saying about it being statistically possible, but it's also statistically possible that the sun won't come up tomorrow - but why mention it? Report this Post to the Staff
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Doubled Feather Buffalo Nickels: Two 16ddo Found!!