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 Replies: 11 / Views: 1,313 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
891 Posts |
Hi all. Hope everyone is well. I was just wondering about how die states affect the price of the coin. I've seen later die states on high ms coins so I'm guessing that the die state doesn't really affect the grade. Does anyone take into consideration the state the die is in when deciding how much you are going to pay? I've never really thought about it when getting a coin, but was curious what others thought. Does anyone know what determines or at what point one die state ends and another one begins.
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Pillar Of The Community
3147 Posts |
If I understand your question correctly, as a 30 year collector, die state has no bearing on my decision to buy a coin. The COIN, the finished product, the current grade, determines the value of the coin whether it be a circulated coin, a mint state coin or proof. Die state never enters my mind as, whether we like it or not, especially with older classics, a brand new die could offer up a weak strike as many variables are taking place when a coin is produced. The finished product lying before me is my concern.
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Valued Member
New Zealand
227 Posts |
I agree with crystalk64, the only things I think about when I buy a coin are do I have this one, do I like this one and can I afford this coin although I always seem to find a way to do that  |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
891 Posts |
Thanks grouse and crystalk for your thoughts. I tend to agree with you both. If I like the coin I try to buy it. Does anyone know if die states are collected as varieties are. I have seen coins labeled as different die states. Why would they be labeled this way if they weren't collected this way? Thanks for letting me pick your brain.
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
3831 Posts |
I hope I am understanding the question right. Are you saying that collecting coins from the same die, but with different levels of wears are collectable? Perhaps it is, as British coins in the past are used to be labelled with it's die number (as I heard) and so, you would be able to track down which die produced what coins, which is definately interesting.
My partial coin collection http://www.omnicoin.com/collection/gxseriesMy numismatics articles and collection: http://www.gxseries.com/numis/numis_index.htmRegularly updated at least once a month. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
891 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by gxseries
Are you saying that collecting coins from the same die, but with different levels of wears are collectable?
Hey gx. They don't necessarily have to come from the same dies, just the different states in general. I don't know if they do collect like that I was just wondering if anyone knew anyone that did. Collecting by the numbered dies would make a cool collection. I don't think that is ever possible on US coins that I know of. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
well I just read this thread and I have to say in the Morgans it definately matters and here is an example. A 1882 EDS of a VAM-4 in MS-63 is about $15,000.00 and a LDS of VAM-4 in the same grade is about $500.00 so it really makes a Difference the EDS is usually the most rare in just about every series I know of. I have seen 200 LDS VAM-84 to 1 EDS VAM-84 but it is an example where there aren't alot of people collecting the series so the price isn't a big difference. But in the case of the 1882 O/S VAM-4 everyone and their brother knows about them and wants one and the EDS is just so hard to come by they will pay a HUGE premium for it. I have been picking up every EDS VAM-84 I come across because some day I know they will be popular (or atleast hope so) because the 1878 morgans are gaining ground and more and more collectors are trying to get a complete VAM set of them and this one is going to be tough. PCGS doesn't attribute both EDS and LDS but NGC does and has only graded 14 of them in all grades with MS-64 being the highest Edited by Bryan1315
09/14/2006 6:09 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
891 Posts |
Thanks bryan1315. I fasinates me on the different ways people collect. I will have to do further research into the die states of coins. Sounds like there are some hidden treasures out there. Maybe as other series become more popular people will start looking at die states as they do with some of the morgans.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2271 Posts |
A great deal depends on the series because some series are usually struck with good dies and some are usually struck by terrible dies. Take a look at 1966 quarters for instance. The nation was in the midst of a severe coin shortage and the mint was overwhelmed trying to make enough coins to catch up. The dies were used well past the point that they would normally be swapped out. It's not only die states that can be bad but also strikes. Strikes can be well centered and full or they can be oblique and weak. Of course they can also be well centered and weak and any other combination. A third factor which is often overlooked is die fullness and hubbing characteristics. Dies are impressed by hubs to get their detail in a two or three step operation. Some dies will not pick up all the detail from a hub so will never impart that detail to a coin. Likewise many hubs will lack detail and the dies made from it and all the coins mades from the dies will lack it as well. This is what makes some coins so very rare with full details like '68-D nickels with five steps.
Where coins with good detail are rare but otherwise available there is a good chance collectors will prize the early die states and full strikes more than the typical coin. Where most coins are well made fewer collectors will care about die and strike characteristics.
Time don't fly, it bounds and leaps.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
547 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by Bryan1315
well I just read this thread and I have to say in the Morgans it definately matters and here is an example. A 1882 EDS of a VAM-4 in MS-63 is about $15,000.00 and a LDS of VAM-4 in the same grade is about $500.00 so it really makes a Difference the EDS is usually the most rare in just about every series I know of. I have seen 200 LDS VAM-84 to 1 EDS VAM-84 but it is an example where there aren't alot of people collecting the series so the price isn't a big difference. But in the case of the 1882 O/S VAM-4 everyone and their brother knows about them and wants one and the EDS is just so hard to come by they will pay a HUGE premium for it. I have been picking up every EDS VAM-84 I come across because some day I know they will be popular (or atleast hope so) because the 1878 morgans are gaining ground and more and more collectors are trying to get a complete VAM set of them and this one is going to be tough. PCGS doesn't attribute both EDS and LDS but NGC does and has only graded 14 of them in all grades with MS-64 being the highest
Funny you should mention the 82 O/S VAM-4.. I have one of these and was wondering how to tell the difference between the EDS and LDS? I will try to get some pics of the coin up soon. Christina |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
891 Posts |
Thanks for the input everyone. Going to put together a nickel die state set. EDS & LDS. 1940-1950 to start and take it from there. I like the look of the flow lines on some of the coins. Ought to be a pretty interesting series.
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Replies: 11 / Views: 1,313 |
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Posted 09/13/2006 10:21 pm
