| Author |
Replies: 17 / Views: 3,768 |
|
Valued Member
United States
467 Posts |
Probably not a new practice, but my dealer has been sending in BU modern coins in for awhile to the refiner. Quite a few also. This includes all proof coinage back to 64, I got to pick through his bags before he sent them out, I didn't see and franks, but there we a lot of BU 50's Washingtons and Roosies.
It's a shame, but it does make all the other more rare.
Anyone one else seeing this out there?
|
|
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
11951 Posts |
Local dealers here break up a lot of silver proof and mint sets, but hey are not sending them to be melted. The ones I know send them to large bullion dealers. The large bullion dealers sell those coins in $100 and $1000 dollar face lots, to investors.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
19931 Posts |
You'd be surprized how long this has been going on.
Lincoln Cent Lover!VERDI-CARE™ INVENTOR https://verdi.care/
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts |
Many jewlers melt coins down all the time. For them there is so much more profit in jewlery than in coins. They have a Jewlery store so why would they care about coins.
|
|
Moderator
 United States
187690 Posts |
 It is a shame that this is happening, but that is the state of the market. 
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
539 Posts |
I'm a darkside collector and dealers melting those is seemingly even more common and rampant. I'm not buying them for the silver contect, I'm trying to buy them to complete a set or for a particualr reason for that coin. And I'm not going to be able to do that with so many being tossed into the fire. I'm really bummed about this. It just makes collecting coins feel second-class or worse to the PM collectors. I just want a dang coin!
|
|
Valued Member
United States
466 Posts |
I completely agree with weavus135 and was talking to a dealer on sunday about this kind of thing. He is a collector as well, not a silver hoarder. He said he thinks its a shame that people can't even sell silver coins cheaper so collectors like me can get their hands on them. He said other dealers who want to hoard the silver, or flip the coins at the same show buy the coins up before customers are even in the doors. Needless to say he gave me some nice deals on some coins. He also said he hates that his kids are going to grow up not being able to buy "junk" silver coins because they are all being melted down. I love me some "junk" silver. It has more character then BU examples in my opinion.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts |
Quote: He also said he hates that his kids are going to grow up not being able to buy "junk" silver coins because they are all being melted down. I love me some "junk" silver. It has more character then BU examples in my opinion.
True it is a mess about melting so called JUMK coins. However, the situation is much worse since many of the so called JUNK could be a 1916D Mercury dime in poor condition or just a G-4 grade. Jewlers would and do care less about a date on a coin. Also, many of the new Silver Coins are being melted. Actually to many jewlers a coin is a coin is a piece of metal. Some time ago at a flea market a jewler I know was melting Silver coins and I asked if he ever looked at the dates. His answer floored me. "There are dates on coins?"
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
7185 Posts |
The same thing happened in the early 80's as the price of metal exceeded the numismatic value. I feel it is a shame to melt coins. Why sent them to be melted any way? 90% silver coins are widely recognized, what is the reason for melting them down into a brick?
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
511 Posts |
Dealers could easily retail the BU stuff for more than they get from a refinery. Collectors and silver investors would love to have a shot at nice coins for bullion-related prices.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
4132 Posts |
The problem is that coin collectors are actually contributing to this by buying so much new bullion silver. If you're investing in silver, you can buy bars or rounds or bullion coins like silver eagles, or you could get rolls or bags of "junk" silver coins. If people bought bags of old silver coins for their hoards instead of getting rolls and boxes of silver eagles, there would be less demand to melt old coins. 90% US coins have well known weights, purity and authenticity, so there's no issue of liquidity versus bullion items (and they're superior to privately minted bullion in this regard). They're also more likely to retain value if the bottom drops out of the silver market, as they still have numismatic value. You can always melt the coins later if the demand for the metal is there, but you can't ever unmelt them if there is demand for the coins.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
12437 Posts |
My local dealer has a wait list for $100 and $1000 face value bags so he is not sending off any silver for melt except for the true scrap(jewelry, sterling flatware, etc). Unfortunately, this also means that he is breaking up silver Proof Sets to add to those bags to be able to fill orders.
|
|
Valued Member
United Kingdom
66 Posts |
I've only just started collecting and I am struggling to find coins and I am horrified at what the world is coming to melting coins when there is someone out there trying to find it or a child trying to start collecting
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
548 Posts |
One would think that with all this melting going on, that coin pricing would go up.
But it takes a while for the market to catch on to true coin availability. In many cases, I don't think it ever catches on. Folks just continue to use published mintages...
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
883 Posts |
I remember when the mint released the CC dollars in the early 1970's. I am sure someone will correct me but I think I remember them going for about $30 ea.
I remember the Hunt brothers trying to corner the silver market in the late 1970's and how that went. I think silver might have reached $50/Troy Oz but I was in no position to speculate so I didn't play. I do recall some local idiots buying it on margin and getting burned when the margin calls came in. I did not cash my gems in.
I vaguely remember that silver was about $4/Troy Oz sometime in 2000. I tried to buy what I could afford but life had me spending money on more valuable things (children).
I remember that through this all I kept the little numismatic gems I had as did those who kept "Grandpa's coins" because they were convinced that the coins were far more valuable than what the local dealer buying at melt would give them.
I will admit that I did get rid of my culls when the market was up on silver and turned them into gold. I don't know what happened to them nor do I care. There are few numismatists living who would care about them and future ones would want better specimens.
Time will inevitably reduce the pool of BU's and those that care will have passed theirs onto those that care.
The only way to ensure longevity on our modern coins is to set their issue face value well over their melt value.
I'm not sure this is what we want but it is the thing to do.
I have some Canadian $20 Calgary Silver rounds. There is more than one reason why I still have them even though I was tempted to turn them when silver was up a few months ago.
A US dealer offered me melt value for them 2000. I walked out of his shop and never went back. I think he is out of business.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
Quote: Dealers could easily retail the BU stuff for more than they get from a refinery. No they can't. That is why they are going to the refineries. How many thousand BU 1963 quarters do you want to hold onto? Are you in the market for a half bag of 1961 dimes all BU for your collection? Most collectors want one for their collection, so the dealer needs to find 5,000 collectors who want one. Especially when you consider that the dealers need to roll that silver over NOW! They can't wait six months, they can't wait a week. A lot of them need to turn it today to cover the checks they wrote when they bought it yesterday. When silver goes up rapidly, numismatic values don't keep pace. Back in 1979 a common BU silver dollar might have a silver value of $6 and a numismatic value of $10. But there were so many available that you had a hard time selling them at $10. Then suddenly in Jan 1980 they now had a silver value of $35, but there was no increase in numismatic demand for them because every one who wanted one had bought it at $10. So the dealer could hold them for potentially months of years hoping to sell them to a collector at melt. Or he could ship them off to the refiner who would gladly pay the $35 today. And that is what they did. I know one dealer who in 1980 shipped 300 bags of BU 1883-O Morgan dollars to the smelter. Hasn't made that date any less common either. Strictly a business decision and I think he made the right choice.
|
| |
Replies: 17 / Views: 3,768 |