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Nz Moving To Digital Currency

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Valued Member

New Zealand
70 Posts
 Posted 07/08/2021  11:04 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add NZStamps to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
NZ is wanting to release it's virtual currency to replace coins and notes in NZ. Will we see a increase in the current market value of coins and notes value? This will see a end to physical money or is just BAU.
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
18949 Posts
 Posted 07/09/2021  06:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The value of a the currency of a country is loosely and indirectly linked to the gross national product (GNP) of that country.

OK to have a digital currency, but definitely not on the same basis as Bitcoin or other similar digital currencies, where the value of the currency is almost entirely speculative, with no basis in real value.

If that were the case, there remains the strong possibility that the superannuation life savings of most of the population would be under the severe risk of being entirely wiped out, with unscrupulous international market manipulation.
As a possible result, there would be the same sort of social dislocation that happened in Germany in 1922, that led to the rise of the Nazi party, and the subsequent tragedy of huge loss of life in wartime.

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So far as the existing notes and coins are concerned, they would find their own market value as collectors' pieces, expressed in the new digital currency, with the possibility of wild swings in value, if that digital currency is not properly set up with a strong basis to real values, such as gold, real estate values, the cost of labor, or the GNP as noted above.
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United States
9945 Posts
 Posted 07/09/2021  09:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TNG to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
If that were the case, there remains the strong possibility that the superannuation life savings of most of the population would be under the severe risk of being entirely wiped out, with unscrupulous international market manipulation.
As a possible result, there would be the same sort of social dislocation that happened in Germany in 1922, that led to the rise of the Nazi party, and the subsequent tragedy of huge loss of life in wartime.


Very well said and I totally agree but that doesn't mean it can't and won't happen again. In the digital world it would be far worse.
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Valued Member
Australia
102 Posts
 Posted 07/10/2021  10:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add polarboy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think if a country was to get rid of physical currency from a collectors point of view. there would be a lot of interest in the short term to collect and most people would put aside some coins for the kids, Like most people have a crumpled dollar bill in the bottom of a jewelry box somewhere. But withing 5 to 10 years I think it would be a case of out of sight out of mind and the bottom will really fall out of the collectors market and there will be very few new collectors in years to come.
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
18949 Posts
 Posted 07/10/2021  11:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That hasn't happened with ancient and medieval coins.
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Australia
1819 Posts
 Posted 07/11/2021  9:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Mr T to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hard to say - Hong Kong doesn't have much in the way of coins any more does it? But I thought collecting was still reasonably popular there.
Valued Member
New Zealand
70 Posts
 Posted 07/12/2021  03:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add NZStamps to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
New Zealanders love collecting coins/stamps, drift wood lol even when/if currency is digitized we will always collect the old currencies. A lot of historical value in coins.
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Australia
13809 Posts
 Posted 07/12/2021  8:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
First off, New Zealand is not going to abandon cash anytime soon. Their survey results indicate New Zealanders are more reliant on cash than citizens of other nations, which are much closer to becoming cashless. RBNZ press release, 7th July 2021. New Zealand will be a follower, not a leader, in becoming cashless.

Nevertheless, the question of "what will happen to coin collecting in a cashless society" is a valid one. My working hypothesis is that coin values will decline, as a result of simple supply and demand: the supply will remain more or less the same, but there will be fewer and fewer collectors. And there will be fewer collectors because nobody will be picking up coins and handling them on a daily basis, which is where the majority of coin collectors get their "Aha! moment" when they realise they want to collect coins.

Quote:
That hasn't happened with ancient and medieval coins.

It hasn't happened yet, because modern coins are still around to provide that continuum of history - and it's that 2500-year continuum that is one of the things that makes me a modern-mediaeval-ancient coin generalist. But once coins are disconnected from everyday society and become artifacts of bygone days, then all coins will suffer the same decline in interest. Coin collecting can and often does create an interest in history; but an interest in history rarely creates a coin collector - especially when the guardians of history in museums and universities are more and more becoming of the "archaeologist mindset" who oppose coin collecting on ethical grounds, seeing coin collectors as part of The Collector Problem which is fuelling the looting and vandalizing of archaeological sites.

We are already seeing this social decline in interest with postage stamps. Postage stamps are dying out; most correspondence that remains physical rather than electronic no longer carries stamps. The only stamps I receive in the mail are on letters sent by stamp dealers who have mint stock to burn through while they still can, and from clubs and charities who buy stamps from those dealers at a discount. Stamps are no longer in everyone's face every day, and so collecting is seeing a decline, especially with the younger generation who've never received or seen a postage stamp in the wild.

Or consider phonecard collecting, which has already mostly died out; a brief flash-in-the-pan hobby that bloomed for the short few decades when phonecards were a daily experience for many people, but which has almost completely disappeared now that they've stopped making phonecards - everybody's got mobile phones and the few remaining payphones all take credit cards. A coin club I'm a member of used to be called the Redcliffe Coin & Phonecard Club; "& Phonecard" was an anachronism held on to for a decade before they changed the name to "Redcliffe Numismatic Society" a couple of years ago, but none of their members still collected phonecards.

Coin collecting will take longer to die out, simply because coins have been part of the fabric of civilization for so long. But die out, it eventually will. Assuming the world doesn't fall into a New Dark Age, of course.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
18949 Posts
 Posted 07/12/2021  9:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Perhaps the interest in gold and silver bullion coins will remain, along with their associated 'rare' limited proof issues.

Also perhaps there is still a good future for historically interesting proof gold sets, such as the
1937 British proof gold set of George V1.
Valued Member
New Zealand
70 Posts
 Posted 07/13/2021  12:49 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add NZStamps to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
NZ will not do away with credit, it is redefining the financial transaction and making it more streamless by eliminating one cog in the process(physical cash) a lot of people already just use a credit/debit card and haven't touched physical cash for years I'm definitely one of those apart from my coin/note collection I haven't touched cash for over a decade.
I watched first reading on our parliamentry channel last week so this is closer than everyone thinks. If it goes to a referendum nzders will highly likely say no.
I have some phone cards.
Pillar of the Community
New Zealand
2945 Posts
 Posted 07/13/2021  12:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Princetane to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There was a move away from Physical money due to Covid 19, but in reality cash still rules in many places. Not every one has or wants a credit card.

Plus the right wing media controlled by rich white people has no idea about the informal cash economy that exists in the poorer, browner and more rural parts of NZ. In South Auckland, most deals are done with cash money. A promise to pay someone or credit on some card is hard in an area where people live payday to payday or there are no ATMS that are safe.

Being in stamps and coins myself, many of our collectors and club members who buy stuff at fairs, auctions and club sales nights - rely on cash to pay for their purchases now as greedy Australian owned banks have got rid of cheques (Too much work and not enough profit - I mean most have used Covid as an excuse to shut down face to face banking - 10 years ago we complained about 9am to 4.30pm bank hours Mon - Friday, now its like open 3 days a week between 10 and 2 and they have to "approve" your entry into the bank).

There will always be a need for cash, just that now most cash in circulation is worthless, even a $100 note is not even a days wages, in 1967 it was 3 weeks wages.
Loving Halfcrowns. British and Commonwealth coins 1750 - 1950 and anything Kiwi.
If it's round, shiny and silvery I will love it.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
11245 Posts
 Posted 07/14/2021  02:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CelticKnot to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This is a fascinating read. I really enjoy the insight and observations on this relevant topic, and it is pertinent to just about every corner of society.
Valued Member
United States
55 Posts
 Posted 08/01/2021  11:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Eagle_Eye to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This topic is something I think about often.
The why's of why the push for ending physical currency.
First of all, Governments don't like you to steal from them!
By stealing, that could be any private sale where cash changed hands and the parties didn't report it on their taxes.
You can't watch everyone physically.
With an entirely digital currency, everything will leave footprints and a trail.
In the USA, the laws are such as any capital gain is to be taxed.
Its really hard to enforce that when you don't know transactions are taking place.

Greed and control is the only plausible reason that I can think of, aside from the thousands of layoffs of Treasury employees, Mint employees, currency handlers, bank employees, and all the folks that must be involved with making Cash possible.
Heck you won't need a physical bank then at all.
Costs of printing and stamping.

Cost cutting,
or greed and control.
Your choice.

EE
Pillar of the Community
New Zealand
2945 Posts
 Posted 08/01/2021  5:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Princetane to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Also cash money (Actual notes and coins) make up just 5% of all the so called money in circulation. About $7 billion in coins and notes ($6 billion in notes, mostly $20 and now $50) and about $850 million in coins (Around $600 billion in $1 and $2 and rest in 10c, 20c and 50c).

The rest is bonds, bank transfers and money that exists only on paper and in cyberspace. Bullion reserves here are low too (A few hundred mil worth of gold).

The size of our economy is around $100 - $150 billion most of the time (NZ dollaz which is about 70 cents USA). Even myself, my assets are worth around $500k and I have $150k worth of debt, yet liquid cash I would have difficulty ponying up $5k. You do the maths.
Loving Halfcrowns. British and Commonwealth coins 1750 - 1950 and anything Kiwi.
If it's round, shiny and silvery I will love it.
Edited by Princetane
08/01/2021 5:54 pm
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
18949 Posts
 Posted 08/01/2021  7:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If a digital currency is introduced, perhaps it wont be in the form of a cryptocurrency, (like Bitcoin), but
perhaps more simply, (in the case of United States) a digital form of the U.S Dollar.
Pillar of the Community
United States
2344 Posts
 Posted 08/01/2021  8:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Oldfordman to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
but
perhaps more simply, (in the case of United States) a digital form of the U.S Dollar.

I would hate this sort of thing. I ALWAYS pay in cash. If I do make an online purchase I do it with a borrowed card and I pay the owner in cash.
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