Coin Community Family of Web Sites
Like us on Facebook! Subscribe to our Youtube Channel! Check out our Twitter! Check out our Pinterest!
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


Welcome Guest! Need help? Got a question? Inherit some coins?
Our coin forum is completely free! Register Now!

So Are You Buying The Coin Or The Holder?

Next Page | Last 15 Replies
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 17 / Views: 521Next Topic
Page: of 2
Pillar of the Community
United States
585 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  4:26 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add KauaiHawaiiGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I've heard many times, "buy the coin and not the holder", and yet people will pay more for PCGS slabbed coins over NGC, and then they'll pay more for an NGC slab over and ANAC's slab, and usually pay more for an ANAC's slabbed coin over an ICG graded coin.

OK, before you all say, but PCGS does more consistent grading and you can rely on a PCGS grade over ANACS and ICG and often over an NGC grade as well, and that's why you buy PCGS slabbed and graded coins .......... but hey, isn't that buying the holder? At the least, part of what you paid was for the " PCGS" holder.

At least that's my position at the moment, now prove me wrong.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1196 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  4:48 pm  Show Profile   Check Collects82's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Collects82 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There will always be a chunk of the market that puts their faith and bank accounts in the slab, and for that group, they are welcome to spend as PCGS > NGC > ANACS > ICG. It's their money, not ours.

But sage advice will always be to focus on the coin itself in its own merits. Maybe the slab label supports, maybe it doesn't. But the smart collector should know what they are buying and spend accordingly.

I was a a coin show yesterday in SLC. Stood next to a gentleman dropping several thousand on Morgan's because the labels said MS66/67. His decision making was all of 5 seconds, his transaction only lasted a couple minutes. Thousand of $ spent. Best of luck to him, but this is an easy way to find oneself upside down in the market unless he has an even crazier buyer already lined up to flip it quick while the market is up. We highly discourage this practice around here. The dealer was surely feeling really good about life. I spent more time nitpicking an 1802 cent and a couple pretty buffalos for $150. Lol.
My hoard of '82s is up to 241! 218 BC x 1, 118 BC x 3, 18 BC x 1, 82 x 1, 182 x 1, 282 x 2, 382 x 1, 582 x 2, 682 x 1, 782 x 2, 882 x 1, 982 x 4, 1082 x 1 1182 x 8, 1282 x 2, 1382 x 1, 1482 x 6, 1582 x 13, 1682 x 17, 1782 x 60, 1882 x 68, 1982 x 45
Valued Member
United States
467 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  4:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add livingwater to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For a lot of buyers it is partly buying the holder. But I think the quality of all the grading companies has gone down some, inconsistant grading, label mistakes, etc. While I think it's good to grade/slab older collectible and rare coins, I'm not in the market of buying slabbed modern bullion. I'm more a stacker. I don't chase MS70 over MS69 ASE or AGE. I don't care. For the same amount of money I prefer buying more raw silver/gold rather than paying a slabbed premium for IMO silly labels like First Strike, First Day Of Issue. These are very common and may not greatly appreciate in value. But to each their own. If someone wants to collect buy/sell slabbed modern bullion then I'm happy for them. And I'm sure the grading companies are glad since they are making tons of money off of collectors.
Edited by livingwater
06/19/2022 5:07 pm
Valued Member
United States
239 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  5:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add captainmandrake1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For certain coins, the holder also represents that a coin is genuine. I know I feel more comfortable buying the slabbed coin if that particular coin is commonly faked.
Valued Member
United States
467 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  6:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add livingwater to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Generally slabbed coins can be trusted. It's wise to buy from well known established dealers to avoid fakes whether buying raw or slabbed coins. There are fake slabs too, fake PCGS, fake NGC, etc. Some have been posted here on CCF.
Edited by livingwater
06/19/2022 6:09 pm
Pillar of the Community
United States
2315 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  7:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bump111 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's often all about the registry sets.
"Nummi rari mira sunt, si sumptus ferre potes." - Christophorus filius Scotiae
Pillar of the Community
United States
5123 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  7:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hfjacinto to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I buy the coin, in this case for $9.64 cents (compared to a raw cost of $15). So the slab actually made the coin cheaper.



But I know what you mean, the only reason I did the NGC registry for my 7070 is that they take NGC and PCGS coins and the reason my IHC registry will never get finished is that I have Anacs coin. But I'm not a registry player.
Moderator
Learn More...
Australia
14375 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  8:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When we say, "Buy the coin not the holder", we don't mean "Ignore the holder it's in when considering its value". It more accurately translates to "Actually look at the coin you're thinking of buying, and see if you find it attractive and appealing and then chose to buy it if you like it on that basis, rather than just rely blindly on what the grade on the slab says the coin should look like".

You should indeed "buy the coin not the holder", but once you choose to by a slabbed coin, you are going to have to "pay extra for that coin to be in that holder". If you really like the coin but don't want, or can't afford, to pay the premium for the slab, that also is your choice; "buy the coin not the holder" means you're making that choice based on what you think of the coin, not on what you think of the slab.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
19692 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  8:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I never buy the holder.
Most importantly you need to learn for yourself; one of the reasons why there are so many CCF members.
"Education is the key to collector success" Like most things in life, the longer you are at it, the better you get . (experience)

If I have a coin that is doubtful, I take it to a numismatic professional for a better opinion than mine, and
sometimes support that opinion with lab testing.


As a general rule of thumb here in the CCF, it seems to me that to justify grading and return shipping fees, the coin when graded should be more than around $150 in value. Authentication comes your way for a graded coin, because they won't grade anything but genuine coins.

For coins less than say $1,000 they are easier to sell on the open market.
Above $1,000 it would be my inclination to have the slab authenticated as well, and I feel appropriate for coins over that value.
For these reasons I never buy the holder, but
I nevertheless support the grading industry on behalf of those collectors that feel they still have lots to learn.
Pillar of the Community
United States
8548 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  9:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ijn1944 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Personally, I don't fuss with the issue. If I like what I see, I get it. If my sole intent was to acquire coins for max sale value later, then I'd go in favor of a PCGS coin. But since that's not my motivation as a collector, I just get what I like--perhaps favoring the coin over the holder. I don't have the 'buy the....' phrase tattooed on my arm (or anywhere else).
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20695 Posts
 Posted 06/19/2022  9:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I do not collect plastic. If I get a coin in a slab I just break it out
just carl
Bedrock of the Community
United States
12222 Posts
 Posted 06/20/2022  08:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add panzaldi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
he who grades by the holder is a fool
Pillar of the Community
Canada
3117 Posts
 Posted 06/20/2022  08:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wrekkdd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have never sent a coin to a TPG and only have 2 ICCS graded coins, a PL66 1964 Canadian quarter (no CAM) currently the prize for my current give away and a 1966 PL66 Canadian 50cent piece. I agree with the grade on both coins and wouldn't be surprised if they graded higher through PCGS, I paid 12$ for the quarter and 19 for the half dollar both if which are under trends. Both prices are after shipping.
Valued Member
United States
224 Posts
 Posted 06/20/2022  09:50 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add newguy22 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Then there's world coins and find out that TPG sometimes can't tell the difference between a genuine and a well-made counterfeit b/c of the lack of experience/expertise.

Even if some collectors know that the quality of TPG coins has diminished, there are still many more buyers who just see the plastic and think, "Ok, that's good enough for me."
Moderator
Learn More...
United States
113567 Posts
 Posted 06/20/2022  10:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
... but once you choose to by a slabbed coin, you are going to have to "pay extra for that coin to be in that holder".
I agree. I have certainly paid more for the Ikes in my PCGS set than I did for those in the Dansco. Not just because of the higher grades. I wanted a PCGS set, and I knew there was going to be a premium attached to it. That being said, purchase depended on the eye appeal more than the label.
Pillar of the Community
United States
3840 Posts
 Posted 06/20/2022  10:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Zurie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A smart, knowledgeable collector will buy the coin and not the holder. But there are many less knowledgeable collectors that rely on the holder to determine grade and value, which puts a premium on TPG-graded coins. You can decide which kind of collector you want to be.
Page: of 2 Previous TopicReplies: 17 / Views: 521Next Topic  
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.





Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2022 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2022 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.44 seconds to rattle this change. Powered By: