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 Replies: 13 / Views: 1,752 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4883 Posts |
New player on ebay, this is as good as anyplace to start: http://www.ebay.com/itm/OSTAFRIKA-W...ht_97wt_1153Look at his other items. Numerous "Portugese" counterstamped "Pillar Dollars" (seems to have become a staple in these scams) but what really gets my attention is the wide range of other European issues that you might not normally think of as being targeted for forgery. If they're all counterfeits as I believe, then this is getting downright scary.... Colligo ergo sum
Edited by Lucky Cuss
03/17/2015 10:13 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1796 Posts |
Aye, even despite the fact they're outside my area of expertise (counterfeits of American coins) not a single one of these looks real to me. I'd bet they're all scrap metal.
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Pillar of the Community
Hong Kong
1270 Posts |
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New Member
United States
4 Posts |
Sorry to sound a complete newbie, but how do you understand it's fake just by looking at a picture?
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2805 Posts |
Most coins are produced by striking a metal blank between two sculptured dies, designed in-house. The same doesn't apply to many fake coins. Some are cast out of metal, rather than struck - this leads to a very distinctive bubbly "rough" look. Many fake coin dies are badly made, which is a giveaway to anyone who knows what the original coin looks like. And it's quite difficult to replicate the look of an old coin - so a fake "aged" look is also common, especially on modern Chinese fakes.
There are other, more sophisticated methods, but experience in these areas will pick out any really bad fakes.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
I agree that all of the coins being sold by this new guy are in fact Numismatic Forgeries. Most of these have been around for a while but a couple are rather nice looking in pictures. These represent some of the "better" Chinese products currently on the market. Appears to have products from a number of suppliers.
For people not overly familiar with forgeries and counterfeits - like EugeneZ appears to be - pictures can be deceptive and in many cases one single coin can not be positively identified from simple photographs. But here there is plenty of warning.
You need to view the content of the auction first. There are some red flags most experienced eBayers are aware of.
1. New seller - feedback under 100 for high value coins.
2. Rather large, valuable or rare grouping of offerings.
3. A seller location in a country where making Numismatic Forgeries is NOT illegal.
4. Appearance of known forgeries within a list of coins for sale.
This listing of items is a great place to start looking for errors in manufacture. Study what he has and compare them to pictures of genuine coins on Stacks or Heritage websites. Too many of the coins look identical even though the originals were made in different ways. The early thalers were often made on roller presses while the Spanish-American 8Rs were made on screw presses and the more modern Germanic issues were made on closed collar presses.
All methodologies leave fingerprints on the coins. That is the best place to start learning how to spot forgeries. A coin made the wrong way can not be real. There are also counterfeit/forgery making methods that leave clues too.
Start there and then move on to what the coins look like - the design details.
The coin listed in the thread - OSTAFRIKA WILHELM II 2 RUPIEN 1893 BERLIN is imprecisely described. The coin is a well known forgery that can be identified by the very ragged lettering - the missing central detail, the poorly formed beaded edge and the way the edge is rounded off by grinding. It was NOT made on a closed collar press.
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Pillar of the Community
Hong Kong
1270 Posts |
Agreed with Nalaberong. They all are not silver made. The seller dare not to tell the weight of the coins posted.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
He is generating bids FAR HIGHER than I expected for such blatant fakes.  I think the old adage attributed incorrectly to P.T.Barnum needs to be updated -  Quote:Today there are dozens of suckers born on ebay every minute. Total sales for this particular thief about $4,000 for today. Shame on ebay for firing the Committee.  |
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New Member
United States
4 Posts |
I agree with the tell-tale signs of potentially scammy dealing here by simply looking at the profile of this particular seller and his dealings pattern. What I was after is that I've seen a few discussions when some of the local "pillars" are seemingly able to figure out fakes just by looking. This is something I think I need to work on. I am not after any particularly old/valuable coins at the moment, but I surely hope to be in that position one day, so I need to star learning. Any pointers in some good general text? I guess, I need to start from the very beginning of how coins are minted...?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1346 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
4883 Posts |
EugeneZ - Detecting fakes by the photos posted in auction listings alone isn't always possible, but if you're willing to become more adept at it, here's a good place to start: http://www.theblackcabinet.org/about/999fine - I had recently brought this particular seller to the forum's attention. See this thread: https://goccf.com/t/205807
Colligo ergo sum
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Forum Dad
 United States
24169 Posts |
Handled. All items removed.
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Pillar of the Community
France
1591 Posts |
bobby131313 : how was it handled ? Was it after a massive report, you got insights, something else ?
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Forum Dad
United States
24169 Posts |
I have ways. Unfortunately for now I have to leave it at that.
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Replies: 13 / Views: 1,752 |
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Posted 03/17/2015 10:38 pm
