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 Replies: 21 / Views: 5,388 |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
3098 Posts |
I bought and sold this 1911-S Lincoln Cent. The buyer returned it saying that the date had been altered and that the third digit had been changed from a 4 or 5 to a 1, so it was a 1941-S or 1951-S Lincoln altered to look like a 1911-S. I have examined the coin carefully. First, there is no VDB on the base of the bust that I can detect. Under magnification it does not appear that they may have been filed off. If there is no VDB the coin predates 1918. There is some extra metal at the base of the 1, the third digit, but there also appears to be extra metal around the 19 in the date. What do folks think? Is it an authentic 1911-S or an altered coin?   *** Moved by Staff to a more appropriate forum. ***Paul Bulgerin
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7614 Posts |
The scratches around the first "1" in the date are suspicious.
I can see why a Buyer would be concerned about the coin.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4468 Posts |
I agree that the marks around the 1 in the date are suspicious and I would also return the coin. Seems like a lot of work to change the date as it would be much simpler to add a S to a 1911. I would dip the coin in some acetone to find out if the 1 is glued on.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2200 Posts |
I gunk around the first three numbers. The first "1" would not have been altered for obvious reasons. And given that the shoulder VDB is not there and has no sign of ever having been there, I would say the coin is genuine. The gunk could be from a die break.
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Moderator
 United States
54280 Posts |
Definitely NOT altered from a 1941-S or 1951-S.  Show your financial support of the Coin Community Family (click here)See my topic on Mexican Numismatic Medals (click here) |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10982 Posts |
The coin does not look genuine in those images. It needs an expert in-hand evaluation for authenticity.
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Rest in Peace
United States
18456 Posts |
Well think about this guys , there is absolutely no reason to alter the first 1 and 9 in date .this would not benefit a would be alterer . the 2nd 1 in date looks a little shabby  I think the MM is ok . The truth is ; I just don't know , can't blame buyer for expressing his concerns .  |
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Bedrock of the Community
Canada
10743 Posts |
Wow, That's a tricky one for sure.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3463 Posts |
I don't think it has been altered. The 9 in the date is the wrong shape, and I don't believe that is the mint mark style used in 1911. The shape of the date looks a lot like a known counterfeit. I found this thread showing a counterfeit 1911-S cent with the same shape date. http://goccf.com/t/271189 for your comparison. Pay attention to the mark under the second 1, the shape of the 9, and the size and location of the mint mark. Edited by cwb
10/31/2016 09:20 am
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10982 Posts |
Quote:I found this thread showing a counterfeit 1911-S cent with the same shape date. http://goccf.com/t/271189 for your comparison. Pay attention to the mark under the second 1, the shape of the 9, and the size and location of the mint mark. I agree cwb. Looks like a die transfer counterfeit and probably is. No way I'd touch that one. |
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New Member
United States
26 Posts |
Quote:
Definitely NOT altered from a 1941-S or 1951-S I gotta side with nss on this one. After studying the 3 coins, 1911s,1941s,1951s here is what I concluded. 1941s alteration: Cant be a 1941s because there would be a larger space between the 19 and 11 after being altered. In the 41 s coin youll notice the s to fall in line with the edge of the nine snd the start of the 4. If the 4 were altered there would be space between and in this particular 1911 coin there is not a large enough gap. 1951s alteration: Cant be a 1951s due to the stamp of 19. Youll notice in the 51s coin that the first digit "1" is much shorter and does not go as low on the coin. If you look at this 1911s coin the 1 is comparable to the original 1911s. While I cant say this coin is authentic, I'm confident that it is not the 1941s or 1951s. And if it is a fake. It's well done. |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
3098 Posts |
The coin does look like a good match to the counterfeit with the line under the third number in the date.
The coin weighs 3.13 grams on my scale.
Paul Bulgerin
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
94367 Posts |
Could we see the reverse, please?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3098 Posts |
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New Member
United States
19 Posts |
It's a Chinese counterfeit. The reverse has a die marker common to quite a few dates.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3098 Posts |
Is that the little bump off of the left side wheat stalk?
I've seen that on other known counterfeits.
Paul Bulgerin
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Replies: 21 / Views: 5,388 |
Posted 10/30/2016 5:20 pm
