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1994 Lincoln Memorial Cent - Steps Over Lincoln Oddity

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tropicalbats's Avatar
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 Posted 01/06/2020  11:42 pm Show Profile   Check tropicalbats's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add tropicalbats to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I thought I'd seen one of these somewhere with an attribution or speculation or something. There were a few memorials in the wheat bag I am going through and found this, but can't figure out what it is.

Looks a lot like a rotated offset doubled die of the steps going right across Lincoln. The lines are raised, mostly in bay 6 with one visible in bay 7.

Thoughts?

1994 Lincoln Memorial cent - reverse oddity




1994-Lincoln-Memorial-Cent---Steps-Over-Lincoln-Oddity
1994-Lincoln-Memorial-Cent---Steps-Over-Lincoln-Oddity
1994-Lincoln-Memorial-Cent---Steps-Over-Lincoln-Oddity
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Tanman2001's Avatar
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 Posted 01/06/2020  11:52 pm  Show Profile   Check Tanman2001's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Tanman2001 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The lines look a bit far apart. Especially when you look at how close the doubled stairs are to each other on 1998 1¢ WDDR-014 (Confirmed stairs through statue DDR).

It's a bit late for me to make one right now, but I think an overlay could help visualize if the lines are too far apart or not.
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 Posted 01/07/2020  12:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Errers and Varietys to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Die Scrapes? http://www.error-ref.com/die-scrapes/

Looks similar somewhat.
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Spence's Avatar
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 Posted 01/07/2020  06:06 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think that @e&v might be right that these parallel lines are scrapes on the die rather than doubled stairs.
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 Posted 01/07/2020  06:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TwistedTrader to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'd like to see a close up of Liberty.
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Willburton's Avatar
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 Posted 01/07/2020  09:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Willburton to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It looks cool! Again that guy had a rough night took it out on that die!
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 Posted 01/07/2020  10:25 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Or a DDR with a slight rotation and the hub rotated back into the correct alignment? John Wexler might enjoy this one?
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 Posted 01/07/2020  10:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Greasy Fingers to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Question to expand learning.....
Since this oddity is affecting the center of the coin, can we rule out Feeder Finger Damage to the die?
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 Posted 01/07/2020  10:58 am  Show Profile   Check tropicalbats's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add tropicalbats to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the comments! This remains a mystery it seems. I agree that it would be unlikely to have feeder fingers affecting the center of the die, but not sure that is impossible. Regular and parallel suggests machine made not just a dropped die or scratched by hand. Still leaning toward some hubbing issue but...
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 Posted 01/07/2020  1:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Since this oddity is affecting the center of the coin, can we rule out Feeder Finger Damage to the die?

I would say that since it affects the center it makes feed finger damage MORE likely the cause.

Remember that the dies faces are NOT completely flat, they ASE very slightly convex. That makes the center of the die the highest point. And on the memorial design there are "bays" at the center of the design that are at the same level as the field, the highest part of the die. So the bay area afound the Lincoln statue is the absolute highest point of the reverse die. Right where I would expect the feed fingers to make first contact with the die. (If the adjustment wasn't far enough off to make contact further out.)
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 Posted 01/07/2020  2:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Panther to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you take the section of the Reverse of the coin as noted in the first photo I posted. Then rotate it 90 Degrees counterclockwise, the flip if horizontally it closely matches the hit under Lincoln.

Dan

1994-Lincoln-Memorial-Cent---Steps-Over-Lincoln-Oddity
1994-Lincoln-Memorial-Cent---Steps-Over-Lincoln-Oddity
Edited by Panther
01/07/2020 2:04 pm
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 Posted 01/08/2020  06:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
If you take the section of the Reverse of the coin as noted in the first photo I posted. Then rotate it 90 Degrees counterclockwise, the flip if horizontally it closely matches the hit under Lincoln.

Curious if this was posted to the correct thread as I don't see any other images you have posted here and it doesn't seem to match TB's images?


The secondary lines look too far apart like Tanman pointed out.
And Condor1 expressed my understanding of the convex nature of the die face for it to be feeder fingers.
(The 2018 dime I found had the feeder finger scrapes pretty deep in the center of the coin, but horizontal.)

The argument against feeder fingers might be the consistent and uniform thickness of the secondary lines.

Very interesting thread.

EDIT: What is the curved line in the bottom half of bay 2? If the top of the C (CENT) could this be a counter-clash?
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Edited by Petespockets55
01/08/2020 06:40 am
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 Posted 01/10/2020  3:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Panther to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Petespocket55;

I posted two photos, and I refer to the first one I posted !
I didn't say an exact match, just resembles the mark under Lincoln.

Dan
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coop's Avatar
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 Posted 01/10/2020  4:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
On Panther's upper image, that is a DDR. The Stylobite lines of the column is showing below the columns. (Probably more of these were affected that way.

But the steps theory I feel is incorrect as it would have placed the statue area above the steps lines that would have been on the bay. (The last thing hubbed would have been the statue over the incuse marks on the dies bay area. I was wondering about an angled set of columns. But probably the same thing may happen, The lines would be under the statue:
1994-Lincoln-Memorial-Cent---Steps-Over-Lincoln-Oddity
1994-Lincoln-Memorial-Cent---Steps-Over-Lincoln-Oddity
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