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Half Cents & Large Cents: What To Look For/Beware Of

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NumisEd's Avatar
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5177 Posts
 Posted 12/19/2020  10:25 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add NumisEd to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Since I am kinda stuck with my (half) dime set [having a hard time finding acceptable 1860+ (half) dimes, not to mention a decent draped bust Half Dime that doesn't cost an arm and a leg], I decided to start looking at Half Cents and large cents.
Anything I should be aware of and what to look for? I have noticed there is a wide variety of colors, from almost black to blast orange, and of all grades and qualities.
Is there a lot of fake stuff going around? Should you stick with slabs only, or are raw coins ok?

Let's discuss.
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Winesteven's Avatar
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697 Posts
 Posted 12/19/2020  11:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Winesteven to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm far from an expert on early copper, but from what I've read, it seems like both NGC and PCGS quite often will "Details" a lot of early copper due to "color" issues. Speaking only for myself, I will only buy slabbed coins to avoid the risk of buying counterfeit coins, raw coins that will come back as "Detailed", and raw coins that will come back in a lower grade than anticipated. On these points (especially the latter point), critics will say I need to learn to grade. But even though I know grading, it's still subjective, so grading disappointments will still occur. Finally, having slabbed coins will make it SO MUCH EASIER for you (or your heirs) to sell that coin when it comes time for that to happen.

One other point, which you've hinted at regarding color: with coins with a BN designation, there's a wide range of colors, even in slabs. Decide what YOU prefer. However, I believe "The Market" prefers lighter to medium "Milk Chocolate" colors, as opposed to the darker/blacker colors. While the lighter colors will cost more, you should also receive more when selling.

With RB colors, coins qualify for this designation if they have as little as 5% red, and as much as 95% red. As you'd imagine, the more red, typically the higher the cost, everything else being equal. As such, decide what YOU like, and can afford.

Since these coins are so old, you have to be a little more forgiving with surface marks and "distractions". Regardless, try to buy coins that are mainly "problem free", and don't have distractions that immediately draws ones eyes to them.

Keep in mind copper is VERY environmentally sensitive, so colors can change, even in slabs. Store them in cool and dry environments. If you can afford it, Intercept Shield offers many products that could protect these coins, even in slabs. If you buy these protective products, keep in mind they only protect for about 10 years, so they'll have to be replaced periodically.

While many members of EAC have several significant differences of opinion with the Third Party Graders, it's an organization you should consider joining if you're putting together a set of Half Cents and/or Large Cents. Their members can offer you a TON more information than I have here.

I hope you found this helpful

Steve
A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!

My collecting "Pride & Joy" is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
https://www.PCGS.com/setregistry/ty...edset/213996
Edited by Winesteven
12/19/2020 11:18 pm
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kanga's Avatar
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 Posted 12/20/2020  10:49 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kanga to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm particularly fond of Half Cents.
I've got a full date set of the Braided Hair issue.
And I've got a full date/variety set of the Classic Head issue.
In those two sets I have only one DETAILS coin, the 1809 C-1 variety.
Plus I have the 1837 Red Book listed token.
Also I have two from the Draped Bust issue.
And for my type set I've got the Liberty Cap/Head Facing Left and a Liberty Cap/Head Facing Right.

Everything is VF or better except the Liberty Cap/Head Facing Left; it's an F-12.

All coins are in NGC or PCGS slabs.

My rules are:
-- get the best coin that I can afford
-- get a grade that reasonably shows what the Mint had in mind
-- get straight graded coins (note the exception mentioned above)
-- avoid porous planchets (lots of those during that time)
-- don't buy coins you know are only space fillers, i.e., ones you'll have to replace later

It will take longer to complete sets if you follow those rules.
And it means saving money to get only one or two coins a year.
But you will like what you end up with.
Edited by kanga
12/20/2020 10:51 am
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Phil310's Avatar
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 Posted 12/20/2020  11:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Phil310 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That's great advice from kanga!

I think I broke every one of those rules. I wish I had been more careful in choosing my Half Cents early on. I still have some ugly coins that I wish I had not bought, and waited for a nicer one. I was in too big of a hurry to fill the spaces. Patience is important in assembling a nice collection.

Good advice from Winesteven also about joining EAC (Early American Coppers). You will learn a lot there.

I got this one by NOT following kanga's rules.
Half-Cents-&-Large-Cents:-What-To-Look-For/Beware-Of

On this one I followed kanga's rules.
Half-Cents-&-Large-Cents:-What-To-Look-For/Beware-Of
Edited by Phil310
12/20/2020 11:43 am
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Winesteven's Avatar
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 Posted 12/20/2020  11:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Winesteven to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Phil310 - Gorgeous 1826! I agree with you regarding the excellent advice given by @kanga above.

Steve
A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!

My collecting "Pride & Joy" is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
https://www.PCGS.com/setregistry/ty...edset/213996
Edited by Winesteven
12/20/2020 12:00 pm
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kanga's Avatar
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 Posted 12/20/2020  11:58 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kanga to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm an EAC member.
I'm slowly converting to their grading methods.
But that's hard for me since I'm a serious NGC/PCGS believer.
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Collects82's Avatar
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 Posted 12/20/2020  12:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Collects82 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've recently re-started my Half Cents collection. I'm just simply working on a date set of the Draped series in pleasant non-details AG-G, because that's where my budget allows.

Even in this lower grade, I know I have to be careful. I also know there is enough coins in the market that I don't have to settle for a Details. Be careful of dings and corrosion. It's rampant and I feel a lot of sellers price their prices as if the problems aren't there and hope a buyer will accept it as "market acceptable". Don't let yourself get talked into it. There are enough of these floating around that patience will get you a solid and honest coin you can afford. Be picky!
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Phil310's Avatar
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 Posted 12/20/2020  12:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Phil310 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
EAC grading is very strict. I joined EAC back in the 1980's when I started my Half Cent collection. I think realistic grading for early copper is somewhere between EAC and PCGS which I think is is too lenient. But that's just my opinion.
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NumisEd's Avatar
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 Posted 12/20/2020  12:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add NumisEd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The 1826 is a great coin, Phil! Yes, I will definitely stay away from "bubbly" planchets.
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Phil310's Avatar
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1101 Posts
 Posted 12/20/2020  12:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Phil310 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I'm just simply working on a date set of the Draped series in pleasant non-details AG-G, because that's where my budget allows.


That will be a nice set Collects82.

You can find nice low grade draped bust Half Cents that have good eye appeal. I have a low grade 1807 in an early die state with a mis-aligned obverse die. It's one of my favorites and wasn't expensive.

I found the pictures of the low grade 1807. I always thought it was attractive for such a low grade coin.

Half-Cents-&-Large-Cents:-What-To-Look-For/Beware-Of
Half-Cents-&-Large-Cents:-What-To-Look-For/Beware-Of
Edited by Phil310
12/20/2020 2:13 pm
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 Posted 12/20/2020  2:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add whatdowehavehere to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sold my first Large Cent (1794) for a profit when I was 12... CLR - Lighter Fluid - Heavy Duty Oven Cleaner - EZest Silver Dip - Care/Blue Ribbon - Sulphur & Vaseline ointment - Jeweler's Rouge - Small Brass brush: these are components of the the Kitchen Magician's Guide to Better Copper Coins Through Chemistry. For instance, there was a Large Cent in a TPG holder: "Unc Details Env. Dam.", now it's the 2ndFK at AU55 same TPG service. Tip: Beware of Unc. copper with strong Blue/Magenta tones-that's pretty much a sure sign of it being exposed to Oven Cleaner
Edited by whatdowehavehere
12/20/2020 2:50 pm
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msb's Avatar
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 Posted 12/27/2020  11:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add msb to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Some truly excellent advice here. I will offer an alternate point of view though. Not every collector wants to acquire just 1 or 2 coins a year and some of this comes down to owning that piece of history and an example of a coin you might not be able to afford in a higher grade or not wanting an example you can afford in the very lowest grades that is barely discernible as far as detail. All to say, in some instances, I think there is nothing wrong with acquiring a Details grade (tooled coins aside) that has nice eye appeal and nicely represents the coin type. It's all individual choice and again, it's hard to quibble with the old adage of "buying the best coin you can afford." But when it comes to early copper, sometimes that may be a Details grade. Anyhow, to each his own pursuits. Everyone enjoys this hobby differently. Happy collecting!
Edited by msb
12/27/2020 11:47 am
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Winesteven's Avatar
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697 Posts
 Posted 12/27/2020  1:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Winesteven to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Some truly excellent advice here. I will offer an alternate point of view though. Not every collector wants to acquire just 1 or 2 coins a year and some of this comes down to owning that piece of history and an example of a coin you might not be able to afford in a higher grade or not wanting an example you can afford in the very lowest grades that is barely discernible as far as detail. All to say, in some instances, I think there is nothing wrong with acquiring a Details grade (tooled coins aside) that has nice eye appeal and nicely represents the coin type. It's all individual choice and again, it's hard to quibble with the old adage of "buying the best coin you can afford." But when it comes to early copper, sometimes that may be a Details grade. Anyhow, to each his own pursuits. Everyone enjoys this hobby differently. Happy collecting!


I fully agree! Welcome to the forum!
A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!

My collecting "Pride & Joy" is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
https://www.PCGS.com/setregistry/ty...edset/213996
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fortcollins's Avatar
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 Posted 12/27/2020  2:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fortcollins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'll offer my standard pitch here. In today's market, eye appeal is more important than technical grade. A VF-35 with strong eye appeal likely will be a better coin than an ugly EF-45. If you have to use the word "but" in your assessment of the coin, take a hard pass.

Just my two half-cents worth.
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msb's Avatar
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 Posted 12/27/2020  5:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add msb to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Couldn't agree more fortcollins. Well said!
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msb's Avatar
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 Posted 12/27/2020  8:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add msb to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
On a related note, here is one of the early coppers I acquired which is a 1794 Large Cent, VF Details with Environmental Damage which in this instance is due to corrosion. The Details coin provided me an attractive, reasonably priced option for my type set where normally I would have left the 1794 hole empty. The corrosion was pretty evenly distributed and it had reasonable detail with nice eye appeal. Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder/collector. :)
Half-Cents-&-Large-Cents:-What-To-Look-For/Beware-Of
Edited by msb
12/27/2020 8:18 pm
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