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 Replies: 25 / Views: 2,568 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11880 Posts |
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.comEdited by numismatic student
12/16/2022 6:42 pm
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Valued Member
United States
187 Posts |
VERY NICE !!! She is a beauty
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
25036 Posts |
Frosty and toned! What a beauty!
Inordinately fascinated by bits of metal with strange markings and figures
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
11880 Posts |
As I examine the images, I wonder if this coin is better struck than the Jack Lee MS68 coin, the finest one graded. If you look at a closeup of the eagle's talon on the reverse, the subject coin appears to have a sharper nail on the talon with a much more rounded 3-dimensional feature. Same with the tail feathers, and the eagle's feathers.   A slightly sharper image of the talon in the subject coin.  This is the superb and top pop Jack Lee coin.  IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.comEdited by numismatic student
12/15/2022 9:50 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2281 Posts |
It looks pretty good, hard to tell from photos.
You bought it for AU money..I wonder what others seen that didn't push it anywhere near MS territory.
I vote AU55
You realize when you know how to think, it empowers you far beyond those who know only what to think.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Edited by NumismaticsFTW
12/15/2022 10:52 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4468 Posts |
I am at 55/58. A nice strike on the coin. The toning does not look natural. The reddish toning near the rims looks like Wayte Raymond album toning, but the pastel blue on both sides looks strange.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
2333 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1510 Posts |
I am at AU-58 based on these images. The seller definitely played with the contrast. Will be very interested to see what this looks like in hand.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3323 Posts |
Absolutely beautiful example! I also see signs of wear, but look forward to your photos when received.
"Nummi rari mira sunt, si sumptus ferre potes." - Christophorus filius Scotiae
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
18649 Posts |
the 84(S) should show above average strike. this one typical for strike. lots of rainbow toning can always hide anything but TPG's love this and will bump the grade for it. you can see there are some minor scratches on both sides but its difficult to determine if its just marks in the toning or on the actual surfaces. i would grade the coin MS65 but with the toning I think it would make MS66 i can see what you're saying about the talon however that area sets higher on the die and would be. the breast tells the tale for strike as well as the hair around the ear. Quote:
And what is going on between the legend and the motto in the reverse? i believe these marks are superficial on the toning. I dont have a concern but its a tough call when looking through that much toning the Jack Lee coin strike is a much stronger strike/ the hair is more defined especially around the ear. the breast feather are more separated and defined than yours nice example. I hope the toning maintains over the years |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5663 Posts |
Beautiful coin with attractive luster. Definitely a VAM-4D with the die chip above the eyebrow. I think there is a trace of wear and some circulation marks in the fields, so I'm leaning towards AU-58. Curious why a coin like this is still raw. Makes me wonder if it hadn't been in a details holder in the past.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2281 Posts |
Panzaldi I'm surprised. I often see you pretty harsh on grades. You do realize the historical significance of the 84-S, how extremely rare a gem is, and how every TPG takes considerable time to make sure the grade is correct on these right? MS66  You realize when you know how to think, it empowers you far beyond those who know only what to think.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Edited by NumismaticsFTW
12/16/2022 12:09 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11880 Posts |
Thanks to all for sharing your helpful thoughts. I wish this coin would grade at MS65. The last two at that grade sold for $150K. At MS66 it is likely to bring $400K. Looking forward to seeing this one in hand. Seller has an unusually long 60 day return privilege so we'll get to dissect the condition of this one and see if it's a gem or a dud.  IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11880 Posts |
Thanks smat45 and Zurie for pointing out this is the VAM 4D die pair. Incredible how easy this variety is to identify based on the die chip above the brow which looks like an exact match. Initially VAMWorld wasn't loading on my current browser but was able to muck around using a different browser.  IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.comEdited by numismatic student
12/16/2022 6:51 pm
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Valued Member
United States
306 Posts |
This is my 58 which was sitting in my grandma's closet for the better part of 40 years before I rescued it for AU 58 reference. It did NOT CAC for reference also. I always error on AU on 84-S...  Edited by cboyera
12/16/2022 9:00 pm
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Valued Member
United States
306 Posts |
Also, the breast almost looks "built up" on the OP's coin. I can't imagine any reason to do that though so I'll try to put that out of my mind.
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Replies: 25 / Views: 2,568 |
Posted 12/15/2022 9:04 pm
