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1970 S Large Date 1 Cent Doubled Die?

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New Member

United States
40 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  01:01 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add justlizw to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I took my 1970 s large date Lincoln Penny to a reputable coin place to have my "poxket change" find evaluated because of the obvious doubling in the date. The "expert" said that he couldn't see any doubling then he told me to get it certified. One of the things that I learned on this website is to make sure that a coin is worth more then the cost of grading and certifying. So I'm bringing it to the real experts to have a look at it. I see doubling north of all of the date, a little on Liberty and with a magnifier In God We Trust.Is my 1970 s lg date penny doubled died? Sorry that the pics are less than amateur. Sorry if I've repeated any I didn't mean to. Thanks for your time
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
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John1's Avatar
United States
56855 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  04:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like MD to me. Did you check all three reference sites we all need to do? Also, stop going to that dealer.
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Spence's Avatar
United States
34423 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  05:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The steplike doubling on the date that reduces the width of the devices looks like Machine Doubling to me too.
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ijn1944's Avatar
United States
19183 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  07:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ijn1944 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Agree, looks like Machine Doubling. Nice example.
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kenwright396's Avatar
United States
1173 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  08:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kenwright396 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
excellent example of Machine Doubling.
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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  09:05 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Agree, this is just MD.
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United States
3207 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  10:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nick10 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
that type of doubling is fairly common, some collectors even consider it a detriment, so not worth grading
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coop's Avatar
United States
62064 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  11:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Take a look at the 1970-S Page on Variety Vista to see what a DDO could look like on that year/mints design:
http://www.varietyvista.com/01b%20L...201970-S.htm
Note that that year has some unusual looking doubled dies. (in areas not seen on other years) But as mentioned, your coin is not a DDO. It is just Machine Doubling. How to tell what a DDO looks like:
Note the DDO-001:
http://www.varietyvista.com/01b%20L...0SDDO001.htm
Note the spread is on the center of the devices. Note on your coin the affected areas you are looking at are on the outside edges of the devices, on all the devices on that area, they are all affected on that one side of the devices. Also the affected area is reduced/flattened by removing the contour of the devices that were there before the post strike damage happened. Thus the devices are reduced in size. Now note the devices on the DDO-001? They are larger, because of the spread of the devices. Not reduced from the machine damage caused post strike. A doubled die coin is from a coin that has hub doubling enlarging the size of the devices. The devices are enlarged. On some of the devices on this year, there is an addition to the devices.
http://www.varietyvista.com/01b%20L...0SDDO002.htm
Note the description box? That will tell you the affected areas of the doubled die. Note that not all images are showing the DDO, but the ones in the description is showing the hub doubling. So always look at the description box to see what really is the doubled die. The difference? The other images that are not affected will be normal devices. But on these images some die markers maybe present. So they are there for that purpose. Die markers are like fingerprints to identify die state of the die that stuck your coin. So looking at the outside edges of devices will show you Machine Doubling or die wear towards the direction of the closest rim. So look for the spread of the devices on the centers of the devices, not on the outside edges of the devices. Hope this helps. Always ask for more information. We are here to help you train your eyes as what to look for during searches of coins. The better you train your eye, the sooner you will spot what you are looking for in your searches. Machine Doubling is very common to find on coinage. A doubled die is more of a rare event.
Note on this image, how much larger the devices are on the DDO-001:
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
Note on this side by side, the Machine Doubling reduces the size even more than normal example?
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
Thus comparing images with the same width, cropped on the same areas will help you see the differences from a normal device size, a doubled die and Machine Doubling. Making these helps train your eyes to know the differences.
Even lighting can affect images:
1970-S-Large-Date-1-Cent-Doubled-Die?
The spread on coins need to be in the same direction/same amount of spread in order to be from a certain die. This all comes with time in knowing/seeing the differences of hub spread. It takes time. We didn't start school and graduate from school on the first day of attending school. So don't give up. It just take time to train the eyes. Hope this helps.
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United States
40 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  12:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add justlizw to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you all for your valuable input and information it's pretty kool to have a go to place for everything error coins (or not error). I look forward to the day that I post a coin that will have you doing the happy dance with me Thanks again for you time
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Earle42's Avatar
United States
10038 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  1:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Earle42 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
One of the things that I learned on this website is to make sure that a coin is worth more then the cost of grading and certifying

Wise.


Quote:
I took my 1970 s large date Lincoln Penny to a reputable coin place to have my "poxket change" find evaluated because of the obvious doubling in the date. The "expert" said that he couldn't see any doubling then he told me to get it certified.


I personally would suggest redefining the term "reputable" when applied to this "'expert.'" He was suggesting a 150.00-200.000 mistake at your expense.

Not being mean...just truthful
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United States
40 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2022  4:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add justlizw to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks to the coin community and a little bit of common sense on my part the "expert" made the mistake and at his own expense. I've posted a review on their website so that others can be aware.
THANK YOU
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nickelsearcher's Avatar
United States
15459 Posts
 Posted 12/30/2022  05:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nickelsearcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Good call to stay away from that coin 'expert'. This is obviously Machine Doubling and not worth more than face value.
Take a look at my other hobby ... http://www.jk-dk.art
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Dearborn's Avatar
United States
96800 Posts
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merclover's Avatar
United States
10635 Posts
 Posted 12/30/2022  5:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add merclover to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Classic Machine Doubling. Keep searching!

P.S. - your dealer is just trying to have you use their 3rd party grading service, which puts money in their pocket. You did well coining here!
Edited by merclover
12/30/2022 5:40 pm
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