| Author |
 Replies: 30 / Views: 1,887 |
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
881 Posts |
This has been happening for quite a while now, but many collectors still treat PCGS as the ultimate authority on grading. Here's yet another example of a PCGS questionable call— How could this Canadian coin possibly be graded MS63 by PCGS? Or am I off in thinking it deserves a lower grade? You make the call...    Edit Note: This is NOT my coin...Edited by CoinForMe
07/13/2025 11:50 am
|
|
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
18070 Posts |
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
Canada
20778 Posts |
Not MS63 in my book but then I'm not getting paid to grade.
Edited by JimmyD
07/13/2025 12:57 pm
|
|
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2287 Posts |
Over graded in my opinion. Just like a 50 cent coin posted by Op.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
Canada
5273 Posts |
Optimistic on PCGS part .
You can find similar in dollar junk bins.
Coin is not new , has been cleaned .
PCGS cannot grade Canadian Coins to
accepted standards for the Canadian market.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
9763 Posts |
The farther away one gets from a modern (1900 and newer) US coins, it seems the grading and verification of ID seems to go downhill. In my own experience on Conder Tokens (Great Britain 1780s to 1815ish) I'd guess they only hit 60% correct rating on just the identification and half that as to grading or designating the coins finish (bronzed, proof-like, proof, uncirculated, specimen etc.) and even less on metal compositions of various off metal varieties. In my own collection only 50% of my Conder PCGS slabs have been correctly ID'd. My colonials are a little better, but I attribute that to most being from the Syd Martin collection with special labels, and Syd was the one who literally wrote the books on them. My US coins are mostly all correct in ID and very close in grading, Morgan dollars, modern proof. I also don't send any coins to them any longer, I still purchase coins in their holders, but I purchase the coin not the holder, that is incidental. I would use and rely on them for very high dollar purchases of very rare coins ie: $5K and up as they at least have a guarantee on the authenticity of them, very important on heavily of often counterfeited coins like 1916-D dimes, 3-Legged Buffalo nickels, 1889-CC dollars etc. As to this coin OP posted, IMO quite overgraded, likely an old cleaned and retoning. low end AU details or straight grade XF45+ EDIT: I'd be curious as to what grade ICSS (the preminent Canadian grading company) would grade it? "Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013! ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS) Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector. See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440Edited by westcoin
07/13/2025 1:39 pm
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
6177 Posts |
Quote:
Over graded in my opinion. 
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
1370 Posts |
It is nothing short of a pay to play racket with NGC being the worst offender. For example, all the garbage pumped out of the VaultBox ecosystem. These guys buy up all the DETAILS coins, get them straight-graded via NGC, and fill up the majority of their black labels with garbage. I've traced back a few resale listings to original details coins. Or take this IHC seller on ebay https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ss...&_nkw=indian, the vast majority of the IHC listings are toned (obviously intentional/accelerated) and each and every one looks way too similar. I can almost guarantee that if I bought a 1/2 dozen, cracked them, and sent them back to NGC, each and every one would come back DETAILS/AT. |
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
1299 Posts |
I would agree that the 1928 cent is over-graded and a mistake by PCGS. That said, all of the grading services make mistakes and have similar over-graded coins out there. Each of the grading services evaluate strike, luster, wear, eye appeal, carbon spotting, dings, discolorations, and other factors differently. They each reward and penalize these factors slightly differently. None are right or wrong, but they simply grade using different philosophies. The grading services also can grade different types of coins differently. For example, I am a Victorian cent collector. ICCS grades circulated Victorian cents much more conservatively than PCGS. However, at MS-63 RB or Red and above, PCGS is much tougher. Other Canadian series have similar variations in grading. Grading standards within each (and every) TPG have varied substantially over time. When a coin was graded is important. I do not buy any blanket comments that ICCS is better, or PCGS is better. It simply depends on many things. They all have clunkers out there in their holders. Knowing how to grade yourself is essential to success in this hobby. http://www.victoriancent.com2011 & 2025 Fred Bowman Award Winner, 2020 J. Douglas Ferguson Award Winner, & 2022 Paul Fiocca Award Winner. Life Member of RCNA.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
7266 Posts |
Quote:Or take this IHC seller on ebay https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ss..._nkw=indian, the vast majority of the IHC listings are toned (obviously intentional/accelerated) Yeah but he has been selling toned coins for years and so far nobody can prove anything. He sells all kinds of toned coppers. I'll never buy anything from him but if it's in an NGC slab you have to take it as such. PCGS does the same with toned coins - but they sure do sell good. As long as the money keeps rolling in it won't stop.
|
|
Valued Member
United States
161 Posts |
Quote:
PCGS Is Not What Collectors Think. I've moved to CAC 100%
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
1370 Posts |
Quote:
As long as the money keeps rolling in it won't stop. Totally agree with you!!! And honestly, the ebay seller's coins are not shabby at all. Still looks intentional but it is a good toning job. The bottom line - when he sends them in they straight - if I sent them in they would details. Pay to play. Like you, I've been putting together .... ssslllooowwwlllyyy ... a collection of 63++ slabbed IHC toners. I avoid NGC if at all possible solely because I do not want one of his coins in my collection.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
881 Posts |
I agree—NGC isn't immune to grading issues either. But today, I was specifically highlighting PCGS.
I own many PCGS-graded coins, so it's not about favoritism.
What I'm pointing out is how some collectors put PCGS on a pedestal while degrading other grading companies for the same mistakes PCGS does..
For example, you often hear, "You'll get more for a coin in a PCGS slab," or "They have three graders grading your one coin before it's officially graded and slabbed"...
Repeating that within the numismatic community only drives up prices and spreads misinformation to its new collectors.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
881 Posts |
You see, I just finished posting my last comment, and as I write it, this was posted! Here is precisely my position as to what I'm trying to say. Please note that this is not for argument. Quote:
I avoid NGC if at all possible solely because I do not want one of his coins in my collection. You say "you avoid NGC", but don't give a reason why you "avoid NGC"? |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
7266 Posts |
Quote:
you often hear, "You'll get more for a coin in a PCGS slab," Well also remember - "Buy the coin - not the slab" - simply for the fact that I've seen all TPGs misgrade/mislabel coins. That's why I always look at the 1970-S cent Small Date closely because I've seen Large Dates labeled as Small dates from PCGS.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
881 Posts |
Quote:
I've moved to CAC 100% Why?
|
| |
Replies: 30 / Views: 1,887 |
Posted 07/13/2025 12:55 pm
