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Replies: 1,627 / Views: 120,157 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
I started to say you could buy the 3 coins already labeled as 25th anniversary set coins and then resend those in to be reslabbed with the other two and have all consecutive numbers but remembered when you resubmit coins in the slab that way they do not5 change the certificate number on the slab, those coins will just show up under both numbers when looked up. The original cert number and the number that was on the submission form
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Valued Member
United States
214 Posts |
I agree with not caring a thing about slab coins. I just want the 25th Annv.set that I ordered kind of late, that is still in processing. Does anyone even buy from those home shopping tv shows? Very first thing I clicked on was a "2011 SP68 ANACS FDOI LE 247 Mint Set - 28pcs" for $400. To me $400 is alot of money for a $31.95 set, thrown in some slabs and a wood box.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
Quote: Does anyone even buy from those home shopping tv shows? the sad part is, yes people do actually buy from those shows way to much. That is why they are on every cable channel available late at night selling everything from coins to swords and knives. I hope no one from this coin forum or any other one for that matter would buy from them but there are allot of people have purchased coins from such shows not knowing you could get the same coins from the mint. Those types of shows usually prey on the elderly that do not know how to use a computer or sit at home all day every day because they are disabled and do not have access to a computer. If no none ordered from them, they would disappear as soon as they sprouted up but the sad truth is they make a killing selling their products and will not be going anywhere fast
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Pillar of the Community
United States
584 Posts |
Eaglefoot if you waited 6 years and sent your sets in. The first thing that would happen is. TPG would receive the coins. TPG would grade the coins. Remove a percentage of your highest graded key coins and replace them with a lower graded match. Then a call would be made. Not to you but the next VIP Multimillionaire on the waiting list. They ship you back your coins. Your open your package and see theirs almost 1 full 70 set or even a full 70 set and are thrilled. TPG sells your coin. And it keeps going like this because theirs not enough of us OUTRAGED bye this request. Sure were not allowed to cherry pick a perfect set. But their free to do what they want. I mean if no one thinks anything like this is going on, God Bless Ya. Whats to stop them. Honesty and money do not mix! Were talking about people who spend retirement money, every time they submit. TPG's are keeping these big spenders happy. Bar None! They couldn't survive on normal submissions. And these big spenders aren't going to accept normal rules. Look how fast HSN had so many 70sets. That says it all.
Edited by amassey08873 11/13/2011 9:48 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
584 Posts |
Let me ask this! Are you allowed to open your package of coins at PCGS or NGC. Say if you live near bye! I'm sure some are willing to travel. I wonder if they would allow you to open your box in the building. This way you can review your order then submit.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11951 Posts |
It sure is interesting reading all the different points of views, on all the different 25th ASE threads. I am not sure there is a right or wrong opinion, but would be nice if everyone tries to understand each others point of view .. which I think most on here really do. For me.. I hope I am happy for all members and friends who got the set or sets they wanted. And I am sure all here wish that, members who didn't get their sets, would have somehow got the sets they wanted. As for a big buyer that might have 200 sets to send into a TPG, what is so wrong with that person working out a deal to put together as many PF/MS 70 sets they can? If it were me.. with 200 sets .. I would want to make the same deal. And in the long run it will help out the collectors that are looking for perfect 70 sets. When prices level off in 6 months or so, it will be the collectors that will benefit from having more perfect sets available. All collectors want rare coins. For us to have rare coins .. it means not everyone can have that coin. Take a look back at last year, the mint made a late offer for 2010 Proof ASE. I am pretty sure they made all that was ordered. Many collectors were hoping this would be a low mintage coin .. turned out to be one of the highest minted ASE proof coins, well it might be the highest .. but I have not checked. What I am getting at is there is not a big premium on the 2010 ASE proof, because many collectors and investors ordered multiple coins. AS for me ... I am still "in process" status with my order of 5. I will not count on having the sets, until I have them in hand. If for some reason my order does not go through, I will just have to live with not having a set, because I don't think I would be willing to pay $700 or more for a set. But that is just the way it goes. I will still be happy for my friends that did get sets.
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New Member
United States
26 Posts |
HOLLYROLLER - My comment is based on "big customers" who pay the TPG big bucks for fast turn around times and large volume like HSN and QVC. I have always listened to my gut. And when you see one source getting "more than their fair share" of 70 grade sets it tells me some other mechanism is at play. The ratio of PF69 and PF70 sets coming out of the batch of big retailers doesn't seem to be in line with what I am hearing and reading from people on the forum. I would think that if something such as replacing coins that are available outside this set so that their big customers got more ( and more profitable) PF70 sets, they would do it. --------------------------- Why wouldn't they just grade the 69s as 70s instead of switching coins? I think that would be easier and more likely.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11951 Posts |
Quote:The first thing that would happen is. TPG would receive the coins. TPG would grade the coins. Remove a percentage of your highest graded key coins and replace them with a lower graded match. WOW! speechless ... and I think this has been gone over before. Do you really think someone that has a multi- million dollar business, would do something to jeopardize that business by switching different customer coins? Do you know have some knowledge this is happening? Most people, including myself, can not tell the difference between a 69 or 70 coin. In my opinion if a TPG were to do anything "special" for a large volume customer, they might grade anything "close" as a 70 grade. Not that I am saying they do that .. but I could see a TGP getting 200 sets .. and saying they need 50, 70 grade sets .. taking the best 50 and making them 70 grade ... I think something like that would happen before switching coins from other customers.
Edited by GR58 11/13/2011 11:00 pm
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Valued Member
United States
301 Posts |
Quote:The three "common" ASE's will have mintages of LESS than 100k. Not all of them will be graded by TPG's....so...does this make them to the TRUE sleepers in the set? The three "common" coins in the set do not have minatges less that 100K. Overall mintage numbers of the 2011-W Proof, 2011-W uncirculated and 2011 bullion coin include the coins that went into the sets.
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Valued Member
United States
223 Posts |
I'm starting to wonder about the TPG thing all around. It's a shame that they can't be regulated but that would open up a whole other can of worms.. I'm liking the post by GR58 and would like to think that's the way it is.. We'll never really know, will we?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2150 Posts |
Quote:In my opinion if a TPG were to do anything "special" for a large volume customer, they might grade anything "close" as a 70 grade 
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1027 Posts |
The overall mintage numbers, when published will include the set coins but the weekly publication separates the individual proof & unc SAEs from the set count. The running totals for bullion coins is the number sold, not the number minted. The annual report should look at the numbers in several ways when it comes out.
The TPGs don't need to (and as far as I can tell don't) bring in outside coins to bolster the 70 and/or 69 sets being offered for sale. It has long been the judgement of the collecting community, as demonstrated through their wallets, that PCGS is the stingiest at handing out 70s, NGC is next, and ANSCS and ICG are the easiest. Pretty much any other company is looked on as a pay for the grade you want outfit. We have no idea how many sets an outfit like HSN got their hands on so to claim that they must be committing fraud or theft is unwarranted. They may well have agreements that let them take their sets to the grading house and open the sets there and weed out the damaged and otherwise not worth grading coins but there is nothing wrong with that. There may actually be times where they deliberately downgrade coins. If they are getting way more 70s of one coin in a set than the others they might ask to have some marked as 69 to fill out their sets. I don't see anything wrong with that if it is done. While they do tend to get a lot of facts wrong when trying to sell the coins, they don't claim that the coins in the sets they are selling came from the mint together. HSN has contracted with ICG and ANACS for exclusive use of "First Day of Issue" labels and this time they lucked out because all of the sets are FDOI, which they define as the first day of sale. Again, those TV shopping guys use reputable companies that are known to be easier places to get a perfect grade. Many individual collectors send their coins to NGC for the very same reason, a better chance of getting a perfect grade than they would have at PCGS. Also, I doubt that these companies pay big bucks for the grades they get. They most likely pay a much lower per coin amount than you or I do simply because of the volume of business they do.
Edited by clairhardesty 11/14/2011 12:15 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3540 Posts |
Quote: "The three "common" ASE's will have mintages of LESS than 100k. Not all of them will be graded by TPG's....so...does this make them to the TRUE sleepers in the set? The three "common" coins in the set do not have minatges less that 100K. Overall mintage numbers of the 2011-W Proof, 2011-W uncirculated and 2011 bullion coin include the coins that went into the sets." By the Mint's count, you are correct. At the numismatic level, no. From what I am seeing on the graded NGC sets that are on ebay, the wording on the label states 25th anniversary set. So, my thought is, it is entirely possible, for the common ASE's to command a premium over the two special ASE's only minted for the set. Reason - the three common ASE's will not all be graded AND labeled as 25th Anniversary Set. So, the count of the graded common coins is going to be less than 100k. I do not collect ASE's and definitely do NOT collect plastic....just wondering out loud.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11951 Posts |
Quote:So, my thought is, it is entirely possible, for the common ASE's to command a premium over the two special ASE's only minted for the set. Reason - the three common ASE's will not all be graded AND labeled as 25th Anniversary Set. So, the count of the graded common coins is going to be less than 100k I am not exactly sure what your trying to say. But I do know the two unique coins in this set have a mintage of 100,000. The other three coins have a much higher mintage. Also, I am not sure how PCGS will label these coins, but how I understand NGC will do it is If the set(s) is mailed in the sealed mint mailing box they will grade all 5 coins. On the slab it will have a label like this 2011 W EAGLE S$1 25th Anniversary set MS 70 ############ (xxxxx bar code xxxxx) EAGLE 25th Anniversary If the box has been opened, then only the two unique coins will have the line "25th Anniversary set" the other three coins will have all the other information, including the title "EAGLE 25th Anniversary" (Title at bottom of label)
Edited by GR58 11/14/2011 02:34 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5641 Posts |
I have in my collecting days, since 1963 sent in 3 coins for grading, I know people feel that the ladder of the " toughest " for grading goes something like this, as stated earlier, PCGS, NGC, ANACS, ICG, ETC. I use to think about the same, Until I sent in my coins, I chose to use the company that did not have a membership fee, ANACS, Which I also learned were changing their standards. I heard back then, ( a few years ago,) They were "cracking down" on their grading outcomes, I to this day being around Numismatist's on a daily basis, attending coin shows and doing research as much as I can, have come to know and change my opinion as to who is the most consistent, true, overall graders, no, NOT Pcgs, Which I believe is more hype and more "big business " for most, other than the everyday collector. Not NGC, YES, ANACS, they have what I would describe as a turn around in their skills and it shows in the grades given out, not undergrading, which I do NOT see as an acceptable practice, but in the practice of being a tougher company to receive a grade of 70, which is suppose to be a perfect coin, and I know I can tell the difference between a MS69 and a PERFECT coin(70). I believe that Pcgs has a reputation of being the big boy on the block and do NOT believe or feed into their hype of them living up to being all that. NGC is in my opinion another good grading company, but again, I do not think the collector is their prime concern, they are also a strong, consistent grading company, but another that has taken the "slabbed" coin, to another level of being a legend in their own time, as does Pcgs. I believe people who do their homework and research these TPG'S would also find the same results and agree that the overall opinion among collectors is a clear path as to whom deserves the title of being the best, consistent, overall, Strong reflection of the use of the Sheldon Scale.....Knowledge is a very powerful tool....  All things considered, the human factor has to enter the equation, not the president of the company, the grader, who is just like you and I, a person who by using their "opinion and experience" does the best they can to give the coins passing his/her desk, the closest grade to the actual facts. I also do NOT think it is proper practice to grade coins, which knowingly are not, a higher grade then they actually are.This practice has bitten some TPG'S in the past, LOL....
Edited by Morgans Dad 11/14/2011 03:04 am
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Replies: 1,627 / Views: 120,157 |
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