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 Replies: 26 / Views: 13,134 |
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Valued Member
United States
68 Posts |
I have seen a few coins graded by NNC (National Numismatic Certification). Does anyone know about their practices, how they seal their slabs, what the coin is surrounded by and grading abilities? I looked at their website but I didn't see that information.
Thanks
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Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
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Valued Member
 United States
68 Posts |
Thanks Dave again! I think I need to make a list of reputable slab/certification companies. The original reason I asked is because I saw a couple of 1925 Commemoratives on ebay that looked like they had gotten oxidation or something through the slab. It looks as though the inside surrounding the coin has foam. To me, foam would hold in moisture....maybe causing this maybe not. Dahhhhhhh if a slab is sealed like they should be three of these coins in a row would not have the same corroded/(wanna be tonned edge look) edge look. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1703 Posts |
Reputable:
PCGS
NGC
ANACS
and in my opinion to a lesser degree,
ICG
In that order,but thats my opinion.Most of the rest are homegrown grading companies.
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by TLS5933
Reputable:
PCGS
NGC
ANACS
and in my opinion to a lesser degree,
ICG
In that order,but thats my opinion.Most of the rest are homegrown grading companies.
I would add SEGS to the "reputable" list myself. That said, "capable" is probably a term I'd use with more discretion. |
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Valued Member
United States
68 Posts |
I thank you people again! I have the list copied to look at frequently. thanks, Di ANA |
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Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts |
As both TLS and SuperDave stated, go with the top TPGs. NNC has a very poor reputation since its owner sells the coins he slabs thus giving him motivation to overgrade. Some of NNC's slabs overgrade by as much as 11 points.
If one is knowledgeable on grading of specific series and the images are of enough quality to made adequate judgements, one can buy good coins in NNC (and other junk graders) for raw prices or below. Otherwise, the risk is high that a coin will be not as represented.
Fred
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Pillar of the Community
United States
830 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by TLS5933
Reputable:
PCGS
NGC
ANACS
and in my opinion to a lesser degree,
ICG
In that order,but thats my opinion.Most of the rest are homegrown grading companies.
I completely agree. And ICG is getting better, IMHO. |
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Valued Member
United States
68 Posts |
Thanks Morgan Fred and AuldFartte, I agree that you should always grade the coin yourself. Sometimes it's a little difficult with a slabbed coin since you can't see the edges. Anyways, I have "THE" list taped on my computer desk now. Appreciation again all! Di ANA |
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Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts |
Grading a coin from an image is very difficult as we have seen in the Coin Grading Practice forum wherein even excellent images often don't present the whole picture (npi). ebay images are notoriously bad and it's almost impossible to make a good assessment from most of the auction images. Hence, the trust we must place in the slab is really the only thing from which we may make a judgement. A shady slabber like NNC is just as likely to put a cleaned, damaged, or other problem coin in a slab and label it Mint State, "forgeting" to label a problem. Case in point: I bought a raw 90CC Morgan two weeks ago (looking for a raw coin to slab and sell at a profit). While I looked at hundreds, this one seemed fine from the image, probably a low Mint State although it was advertised as "MS-64/65". When I got it, I looked at it under glass and it had an "X" inscribed over Liberty's face. The X was visible only under magnification and only under a glancing light, certainly not visible in an image. I returned it and am awaiting a full refund. I would not have bought it without a return policy. If it had been in an NNC slab, I might have gambled on it (presuming the seller had a return policy), bidding raw prices and for the same investment reason. I still would have returned it. If it had been in an NGC or PCGS slab (which it would not have been), I would have known for certain its status. In an ANACS slab, it would have been marked as "graffiti". The original purpose of encapsulation was to enable buyers to buy a coin sight unseen with a reasonable probability that the coin is as represented. NNC along with hundreds of other boiler room slabbers have abused this concept and have lost the trust of thousands of collectors. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1703 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by Morgan Fred
Grading a coin from an image is very difficult as we have seen in the Coin Grading Practice forum wherein even excellent images often don't present the whole picture (npi). ebay images are notoriously bad and it's almost impossible to make a good assessment from most of the auction images. Hence, the trust we must place in the slab is really the only thing from which we may make a judgement. A shady slabber like NNC is just as likely to put a cleaned, damaged, or other problem coin in a slab and label it Mint State, "forgeting" to label a problem.
Case in point: I bought a raw 90CC Morgan two weeks ago (looking for a raw coin to slab and sell at a profit). While I looked at hundreds, this one seemed fine from the image, probably a low Mint State although it was advertised as "MS-64/65". When I got it, I looked at it under glass and it had an "X" inscribed over Liberty's face. The X was visible only under magnification and only under a glancing light, certainly not visible in an image. I returned it and am awaiting a full refund. I would not have bought it without a return policy. If it had been in an NNC slab, I might have gambled on it (presuming the seller had a return policy), bidding raw prices and for the same investment reason. I still would have returned it. If it had been in an NGC or PCGS slab (which it would not have been), I would have known for certain its status. In an ANACS slab, it would have been marked as "graffiti". The original purpose of encapsulation was to enable buyers to buy a coin sight unseen with a reasonable probability that the coin is as represented. NNC along with hundreds of other boiler room slabbers have abused this concept and have lost the trust of thousands of collectors.
Thats odd about the 90CC Fred.I bought a 1894-O a while back and when I received it and looked at it under 10x,it also had a big X cut into the face but it was cut with something so fine you could only see it under magnification. I sent it back ang got a full refund but its strange someone would do that to the coins.  |
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Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts |
Terry, sounds like we had the same guy do the X-carving. This X was so fine it might have been done with a needle. It's almost impossible to see the X in hand. I only noticed it as I was getting ready to send it to NGC when it caught the light just right. I put it under my 10X pocket lens and it sprung right out at me. I had already notified the seller that I thought it might have been dipped at some time long ago, but wasn't sure enough to warrant sending the coin back, was gonna take a chance that NGC might see things differently. Sure enough, once they saw that X (and as grading experts, they couldn't miss it), they would have seen it differently alright, right into a body bag. And as soon as I noticed it, that was that and back to the seller it went. He didn't sound too happy in his response to my email, even a little disbelieving, but if he's as honest as I think he is (and 100% feedback), he'll accept it as reality. Meantime, according to the Signature Confirmation, he received it back two days ago and I'm still waiting for my PayPal payment. But, he was also slow to send it, so I can be a little patient.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1703 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by Morgan Fred
Terry, sounds like we had the same guy do the X-carving. This X was so fine it might have been done with a needle. It's almost impossible to see the X in hand. I only noticed it as I was getting ready to send it to NGC when it caught the light just right. I put it under my 10X pocket lens and it sprung right out at me. I had already notified the seller that I thought it might have been dipped at some time long ago, but wasn't sure enough to warrant sending the coin back, was gonna take a chance that NGC might see things differently. Sure enough, once they saw that X (and as grading experts, they couldn't miss it), they would have seen it differently alright, right into a body bag. And as soon as I noticed it, that was that and back to the seller it went. He didn't sound too happy in his response to my email, even a little disbelieving, but if he's as honest as I think he is (and 100% feedback), he'll accept it as reality. Meantime, according to the Signature Confirmation, he received it back two days ago and I'm still waiting for my PayPal payment. But, he was also slow to send it, so I can be a little patient.
Hope it wasen't the same dealer...lol.Mine also had 100% posi feedback. Mine was a little slow paying back also.He said he sent a check but It didn't show up in two weeks.I asked why he sent a check when I paid with paypal,he should refund with paypal. He refunded with paypal finally. He also said he never saw the X on the coin when he sold it but you couldn't miss it if you took the time to go over it.Sometimes I think they think you might miss the flaws until its to late,but that probably just the cynic in me.  Oh,and the check showed up in three weeks. I returned it with a big X on it. |
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Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts |
My seller was from Houston, TX. If yours was also, we may have something here.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1703 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by Morgan Fred
My seller was from Houston, TX. If yours was also, we may have something here.
 Mine was TX also but I don't remember which city.I will have to go back and look. |
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Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts |
Here's a good example of NNC at work, an offering by the slabber himself for an "XF-45" 1879-CC Morgan. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...140064530613Other than the images being so poor that it's difficult to make an assessment of the coin, it's likely it wouldn't grade out at more than VF-30 or -35 at a real TPG (ANACS, NGC, PCGS). Worse, it appears the Morgan has been cleaned. |
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Replies: 26 / Views: 13,134 |
Posted 12/10/2006 6:32 pm
