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Lincoln Cents And Zinc Rot?

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hfjacinto's Avatar
United States
7273 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  09:45 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add hfjacinto to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hey all,

I don't do coin roll hunting but I do look through my change and I've noticed that the zincoins (after 1982) have gotten worse and worse (please note not scientific, just based on pocket change). While it used to be that I would 2 out of 10 cents back in good shape, it's becoming 1 out of every 20 and I see zinc zits on even AU coins and new releases. I went out and used cash to get change of the 19 Lincoln cents I got back all 4 2019 shield cents had ugly black zinc zits, while the older 1980-1990 zincoins didn't have them. They were more worn but no zinc zits. Did the mint change it's formula? Anyone else see this?

I'm not comparing the zincoins to the pre 1982 coppers and those seem to be aging well, the zincoins are a sad sorry coin lately. Well what I get in change..
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jonnin's Avatar
United States
128 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  09:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jonnin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
zinc is more chemically reactive and the copper layer is extremely thin. Circulated coins get dinged enough to expose the zinc and something (acidic, usually) gets in there and you get various chemistry going on.

Take heart: there are proof like steelies in collections that are fine. But note that most of the circulated ones have almost no zinc left and what is left has turned black in many cases. I would think that well stored collectable coins are going to be just fine, but you want to be sure to keep them stored in a high quality container.

I don't know if they thinned the copper more or not. I think they have, but that is pure uninformed opinion.
Edited by jonnin
10/05/2019 09:54 am
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DeputyMax's Avatar
United States
424 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  10:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DeputyMax to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've definitely noticed a difference. Not only are the black spots appearing almost immediately, but there seems to be an over abundance of gas bubbles in the copper plating.
I don't know if they changed the way they made the planchets, or if it's a quality control issue or what, but quite frankly, these zincolns are an embarrassment.
Sorry to say, but I guess it's time to retire the cent, or at most make it a NIFC issue made from it's pre 1982 composition for inclusion in uncirculated mint and proof sets only (just like the half dollar)..
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John1's Avatar
United States
56855 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  11:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I go through 5-10 rolls of cents each day and have noticed. Not only zincolns but all cents are a lot more dirty and have the "Green Rot" on them also.
John1
Edited by John1
10/06/2019 04:30 am
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jonnin's Avatar
United States
128 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  11:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jonnin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I wonder if we could mint out of recycled potmetal or something for cents. A win-win. I don't think we will ever retire the penny, but I don't get why they make so many of them. There are so many in circulation if they made no more for a decade we would be fine.
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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  12:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The Zincolns are an everyday reminder of this country's lack of pride in its coinage.
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DeputyMax's Avatar
United States
424 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  3:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DeputyMax to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
There are so many in circulation if they made no more for a decade we would be fine.

You're right and that would give them plenty of time to solve the current situation or decide to eliminate the cent altogether.

Quote:
The Zincolns are an everyday reminder of this country's lack of pride in its coinage.

What ever happened to "If you can't do something right, don't do it at all"?



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Ballyhoo's Avatar
United States
1613 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  4:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ballyhoo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Lincoln-Cents-And-Zinc-Rot?
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There are no problems only solutions - the late, great John Lennon
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cladking's Avatar
United States
2270 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2019  6:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cladking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have noticed that an even half way decent zincoln is getting tough.

I suspect the reason that coppers are fairly steady at 5% is that the zinc coins are rotting faster than the coppers are being hoarded. The cost to the taxpayer for this nonsense is very high.
Time don't fly, it bounds and leaps.
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ijn1944's Avatar
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19126 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2019  06:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ijn1944 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Interesting conversation. I search through thousands of cents a week and--of course--come across large numbers of zinc cents. I haven't noticed any increase in zinc rot. Among other things, I keep any cents which appear to be MS64 or better--and that hoard just gets larger and larger. That pile contains an overwhelming number of pristine late 80s through late 2000s coins. Perhaps being out in the western 40% of the US where humidity isn't much of a problem contributes to the relative stability of Zincolns. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of rot out there, I just haven't noticed a rot increase in daily finds, or in what I've been holding onto for years.
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cladking's Avatar
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2270 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2019  09:49 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cladking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Interesting conversation. I search through thousands of cents a week and--of course--come across large numbers of zinc cents. I haven't noticed any increase in zinc rot. Among other things, I keep any cents which appear to be MS64 or better--and that hoard just gets larger and larger. That pile contains an overwhelming number of pristine late 80s through late 2000s coins. Perhaps being out in the western 40% of the US where humidity isn't much of a problem contributes to the relative stability of Zincolns. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of rot out there, I just haven't noticed a rot increase in daily finds, or in what I've been holding onto for years.


It's not so much the dreaded rot that is increasing so much since once they start rotting, they don't last long. What's increasing is the black spots that appear on brand new coins. I coincidentally had three nice Gems on my dresser yesterday received in change ('18, '18-D, and '19-D) and all three had horrible black spotting. The '18(P) wasn't quite so bad.
Time don't fly, it bounds and leaps.
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hfjacinto's Avatar
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7273 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2019  1:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hfjacinto to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm noticing the black zits on new coins. The 2019 just seems terrible while the 2017 are mostly ok.
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everything's Avatar
United States
493 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2019  6:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add everything to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
They all get black spots, you can smell them, they stink. Zinc is a really good protector, you see it on ship screws. But zinc pennies have always been spotty looking to me. Due to the thin copper coating they will catch whatever the other copper or zinc coated copper coins have going on.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2019  9:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Don't complain to much. The Mint makes them like that so people will really start saying get rid of that thing. If not enough complaints, the Mint will start making the Cent out of Cheese or clay or plastic or ..............
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fortcollins's Avatar
United States
3628 Posts
 Posted 10/07/2019  12:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fortcollins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just a few thoughts and rants. We have a long history of poor substitute metal coinage. The zinc plated steel cents rusted when the thin zinc layer quickly wore in circulation. The wartime nickels were too soft, and wore quickly. The copper plated zinc cents have a thin layer of copper on the obverse and reverse, which is problematic, but a double thickness layer on the edge, which works better. The brass-manganese-nickel dollar coins have the same rapid ugliness as the zinc cents. The only long-lasting and successful substitute metal coinage is the cupro-nickel-clad coinage (and its cousin, the briefly used silver clad half dollar coinage).

The problem with the cents is the bonding of the thin plating with the zinc. Zinc oxidizes quickly, which creates a protective layer. That's a good trait, because it protects what lies beneath. That makes it a perfect galvanizing metal for steel, for example.) Jarden Zinc makes the cent blanks, using a proprietary plating method that double-plates the edges and single-plates the surfaces. IMHO, three issues appear to exist:
The zinc core thinly oxidizes before plating. This places the zinc oxide in contact with the bottom of the copper plating, as well as normal oxidation from the outside surface. The plating is too thin on the coin surfaces to withstand this two-pronged attack. The edge plating is thicker, and better resists this issue.
The upsetting mill conversion of a blank into a planchet comes after plating. The resulting metal stress affects the surface plating near the proto-rim. This is a common area for deterioration.
The planchets are soft enough to be struck without annealing. The force of striking weakens the copper surface plating at stress points, particularly the raised lettering and more sharply defined devices. This is the most common area for deterioration.

Canada experimented with copper plated zinc cents, as well. The Canadian cents do not show the level of deterioration seen on the U.S. copper plated zinc cents, though they do show the same ugliness from loss of detail and surface discoloration. Canada also used copper plated steel cents toward the end of its production run of one cent coins. These coins fared much better in circulation, partly because copper bonds much better with steel and partly because Canada ceased production of one cent coins soon thereafter, and the coins did not circulate as heavily.

On a positive note, the massive unnecessary supply of zinc cents guarantees a supply of zinc oxide for retro sunburn cream for lifeguards' noses for many endless summers.
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cladking's Avatar
United States
2270 Posts
 Posted 10/07/2019  09:33 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cladking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
On a positive note, the massive unnecessary supply of zinc cents guarantees a supply of zinc oxide for retro sunburn cream for lifeguards' noses for many endless summers.


Thanks for all the info.

These "coins" are a handy source of zinc. I've used them for various things including avoiding a trip to the drugstore when I realized I might not have been getting enough zinc in my diet. A short soak in vinegar renders the vinegar suitable for a high zinc salad dressing.

When the government deals us lemons, make lemonade.

Zinc is a poor electrical conductor but it can be pounded into stronger metals to bridge gaps.

With the many uses for zinc we probably have a 10,000 year supply right in what the mint calls "circulation". We might only have a 6 month supply of corn but we can all have pockets full of pennies.
Time don't fly, it bounds and leaps.
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