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1946 S LWC W/Mmv-006 (Scarce)

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Pillar of the Community

United States
877 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  6:59 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Dowhat to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Most have MMV-004 Trumpet tail. To me this looks like MMS-006. As per VV.
1946-S-LWC-W/Mmv-006-Scarce
1946-S-LWC-W/Mmv-006-Scarce
1946-S-LWC-W/Mmv-006-Scarce
1946-S-LWC-W/Mmv-006-Scarce
1946-S-LWC-W/Mmv-006-Scarce
1946-S-LWC-W/Mmv-006-Scarce
1946-S-LWC-W/Mmv-006-Scarce.
What say you?
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Dearborn's Avatar
United States
97511 Posts
Bedrock of the Community
Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  7:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Might be 006, but a goner whatever it is.
Pillar of the Community
United States
877 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  7:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dowhat to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'll soak it for a spell and try some rejuvenation and restoration efforts, I believe most of that crud will come off.
Regardless, it is always good to know what to look for, even when others tell you it's trash.
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silviosi's Avatar
Canada
6244 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  7:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add silviosi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For MMS-006 this it is the part to look for. I can not determinate from actual photos.
1946-S-LWC-W/Mmv-006-Scarce
Pillar of the Community
United States
877 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  7:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dowhat to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I just might have found my first coin considered scarce, much less rare, and a fellow members response is, " To crappy for ME to keep".
Thanks for ruining a good day for me.
I never would have known this variety existed if not for those of you here. I have gained enough knowledge to try and make my own assumptions now. I will stop in here less in the future.
I would like to see an example that one of you may have to compare.
Pillar of the Community
United States
877 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  8:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dowhat to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Perhaps I will update after conservation efforts. I have made many worse than this come back to life without aggressive measures returning them to a natural state. Takes time and effort. Most of that is crud!
It only takes one naysayers to discourage some people. I have seen many new members never come back lately.
Encouragement will always prevail over criticism. Right/ Wrong!
I regret posting this find.
Pillar of the Community
United States
877 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  8:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dowhat to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
For MMS-006 this it is the part to look for. I can not determinate from actual photos.
Click to see a Larger Image!


I disagree Silviosi. The giveaway is the upper serif for starters. Can you not compare the two?
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Dearborn's Avatar
United States
97511 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  8:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dearborn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Dowhat: Don't be discouraged by some of the comments - I get what you are saying. Most of the folks here will just be brutally honest in THEIR OWN opinion. right or wrong.
Yes some new member stop in and leave - I did the exact same thing - I joined in 2020 then disappeared for a full year before coming back and staying.
Your coin IS in rough condition, It quite possibly be exactly what you say it is. It does need some care and careful conservation for us to see the MM better without the darkness and shadows.
In addition the MM does look the have taken a few hits, which can change the appearance, It does not change that it could be the 006.
I'm excited for you, please try to get some of the gunk off the surface and repost it here.
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ijn1944's Avatar
United States
19210 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  9:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ijn1944 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, will be interesting to see the coin after a de-gunking--particularly with the mint mark.
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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  9:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I did not mean to offend. I just don't believe this coin can be restored to a natural-appearing surface.
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silviosi's Avatar
Canada
6244 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2023  10:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add silviosi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@ Dowhat Please do not be on defense with me. They are a few who has almost same marks on upper MM. For your coins I need better pic where I told you. If upper are almost similar, the bottom made the big difference. I do not go with people if are rusty or no in this hobby. I go by coin, notes, stamps, artifact. I start a day long time and I learn every time.

You I see are very passionate and learning, discovering and analyzing. For me mean at one point this hobby will expand his legacy.
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lawest's Avatar
United States
1998 Posts
 Posted 04/18/2023  12:33 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lawest to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Appears to be MMS-006 but that in itself does not make your coin scarce. The scarce MMS-006 is the die with the inverted mint mark. where the ball is on bottom. Here is the VV listing. http://varietyvista.com/01a%20LC%20...6SIMM001.htm
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silviosi's Avatar
Canada
6244 Posts
 Posted 04/18/2023  01:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add silviosi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Lawest you show MMoo1 not the 006 Revise please. what it is scarce for you to state this? The VV site? sorry you are far.
Pillar of the Community
United States
877 Posts
 Posted 04/18/2023  10:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dowhat to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here is what I have learned.
According to VV, three punches were used that year. 1. MMS-004 Serif/Trumpet tail, 2. MMS-004 Ball Serif, with flat end on tail, 3. MMS-007,Sans serif.
VV notes that MM-006 is "scarce". This can be illustrated by the fact that of the 52 attributed RPM's on Coppercoins, only one MMS-006 is listed, that being 01-025. The Coin I presented is not 01-025.
Appears to be MMS-006 but that in itself does not make your coin scarce. The scarce MMS-006 is the die with the inverted mint mark. where the ball is on bottom. Here is the VV listing
.
Latest, stating it is not scarce contradicts VV analysis. You point to the 1946 S (inverted). The only example of an inverted MM for LWC. You are incorrect in stating that this coin is scarce. It is in fact extremely rare! Perhaps due to the fact that it happens to be the scarce to find MMS-006, Ball Serif as you pointed out. Were it MMS-004 or MMS-007 that was inverted many more examples of the variety would exist compared to MMS-006.
I have cleaned the mintmark up a bit and have no doubt it is MMS-006.
Silviosi, the area you circled is not the focal point. It may appear to you to be a RPM but that is not the issue here. As I stated earlier, CC lists only one RPM for MMS-006 and this it not it. I believe what you are pointing out is a characteristic of the punch.
Granted, the coin is not in great shape, none the less a bit hard to acquire. I was never aware of it until now. Perhaps I will come across a nicer one in the future now that I know to look for it.
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HGK3's Avatar
United States
574 Posts
 Posted 04/18/2023  2:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add HGK3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've always understood the 1946 S mintmark to show up in one of three styles:

MMS-004 which has a straight serif with a trumpet tail

MMS-007 which is a sans serif version

and

MMS-006 which normally has the trumpet tail on the lower left and the ball serif on the upper right.

However, I've also always understood that the MMS-006 only shows up in 1946 as an Inverted Mint Mark. In other words, every 1946 S with MMS-006 will show the ball serif in the lower left and the trumpet tail in the upper right (Inverted).

Variety Vista's listing for MMS is confusing because it shows a photo of the ball and serif version of the MM, but that is because it's showing us how the non-inverted MM appears on the 1944 and 1945 cents.

When that page lists 1946 it's with the term Inverted as a hyperlink next to it that if you click on will show you only the inverted MM for 1946.

I suspect what you have is an MMS-004 that has undergone some circulation flattening to make the serif look fatter and more ball like.
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