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 Replies: 21 / Views: 1,538 |
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Valued Member
United States
134 Posts |
I found this FUGIO coin and am in need of assistance... 1. Is it real (i think so from what my beginner numismatic eyes can see and what I researched). 2. I am having a very hard time identifying the Type (PCGS is a bear to interpret sometimes.) 3. Should I send out for grading? Seems to be a in VG/F condition...maybe. Again...I'm a beginner...be gentle!! thanks P.S. I know the obverse is a little grainy...trying my best!!!   |
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Moderator
 United States
56855 Posts |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10995 Posts |
I don't think this is real because the coin looks like it was struck in a collar and is thus perfectly round. Can you show us the edge?
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS My coin e-commerce website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Moderator
United States
54172 Posts |
Quote:
I found this FUGIO coin Could you please tell us more about finding this coin?
Show your financial support of the Coin Community Family (click here)See my topic on Mexican Numismatic Medals (click here) |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2207 Posts |
I vote fake.
You realize when you know how to think, it empowers you far beyond those who know only what to think.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4233 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1862 Posts |
Out of my wheelhouse but kbbpll makes a compelling argument for it being genuine. Waiting for the experts to weigh in on this.  Edited by MisterT
01/13/2024 6:51 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1100 Posts |
I am hardly an expert having seen less than a dozen of these but agree there are several die characteristics that match.
I think this is definitely worth sending in for grading.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4398 Posts |
Here is a look at the two different coins that kbbpll notes that are a match. If there is a die pair with the same obverse and reverse, I agree the coin appears genuine. OP  PCGS  PCGS  OP  |
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Valued Member
United States
398 Posts |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10995 Posts |
Well, it seems like we can tell that the two coins in Slider23's comparison images did not come from the same dies. See the distance between the denticles at 12 o'clock to the top ring at the reverse. There seems to be a rather large space in the OP's coin between the denticles and the top ring. Looking further down at the authentic coin, the space between the denticles and the top most ring at 12 o'clock is very small. Thus we can conclude that although the design is very similar, the reverses did not come from the same die. In the 18th century we know that denticles were on the die from examples of off center struck fugio cents as in the example in the 3rd picture shown below.    IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS My coin e-commerce website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4233 Posts |
Quote:
Do you just know these in your head, like how on earth can you pinpoint them like that? Haha, nah, I just like looking at details I guess. I know next to nothing about Fugio cents. First, I noted how wacky the arrangement of WE ARE ONE appears. I went straight to Heritage and started hovering over their large images looking to match that arrangement. Then I noted the vertical die crack in the second OP image, which clearly matched. Then the text of a listing mentioned the obverse die clash, and I noticed it on the OP image too. From there I narrowed my Heritage search to "fugio cent clash" and lots of them popped up. Next I zoomed in on side by side images and started comparing tiny details. @numismatic student, I'm convinced this is die pair N. 13-X, W-6855. Search Heritage for it and compare all the little things circled below. There are a few with weak or abraided more distant denticles; I don't have an explanation for what you observed or why. However, the fact that so many other features are identical seems convincing to me. Is it a fake from this die pair? I can't say for sure, but if so it's really good. 
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12046 Posts |
Fugios varied widely since quite a few were struck on "recycled" planchets. Double strikes, single and double clips, overstrikes, heavily clashed dies, die cracks/chips, and planchet voids are all to be found. I think OP's coin is possibly authentic. It looks like a typical 13-X but with planchet issues especially on the obverse. This is one of the most common Fugio varieties, and there are many high-grade examples thanks to the Hoard. The planchet striations and obverse clashing also look as expected. There is a planchet void on the dial at I, and quite a large area of peeling from MYB over to the left star. Here is my O-14, an NGC VF20 coin, for comparison of OP's coin vs. another STATES UNITED variety (although this one is R4 instead of R1). I think OP's example is at least VF30.    Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890 "Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1566 Posts |
Paralyse got it, 13-X not a bad coin at all.
Edited by lcutler
01/14/2024 04:36 am
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Valued Member
 United States
134 Posts |
Thanks everyone. I'll try to get some shots of the edge. When I say I "found it" I mean it was in the bottom of some of the boxes that I inherited from my grandfather's collection. It was a loose coin, and me being an extreme novice, I had no idea what it was but it looked interesting. Thanks for all the feedback. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1100 Posts |
Let us know what you find out.
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Replies: 21 / Views: 1,538 |
Posted 01/13/2024 4:40 pm
