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Circulated Vs SMS Coins

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Humanist1287's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2025  05:37 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Humanist1287 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
So I was just thinking about different circulated and BU business strike coins vs SMS coins for those years.

In my Kennedy set, I have the 1965, 66 and 67 coins. Pretty sure they are in BU condition.

However, I don't know if they are just BU business strikes, or SMS coins. I don't really remember them being SMS.

This kind of goes for other coins as well. My Jefferson nickel "SMS" coins basically look just like proofs. How the heck do you differentiate? I mean, I know sometimes you can tell since SMS coins are apparently "proof-like." However, in cases like this, I'm just not sure.

Any advice?
Edited by Humanist1287
09/03/2025 05:38 am
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BStrauss3's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2025  09:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BStrauss3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's only a small increment. Instead of specially prepared dies, specially prepared planchets, higher tonnage on the press, and special handling for proofs, the SMS coins are just fresh dies, regular planchets, and press tonnage. And minimal special handling to package them.
-----Burton
50+ year / Life / Emeritus ANA member (joined 12/1/1973)
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beerandchips's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2025  09:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add beerandchips to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I wish I could offer advice! I have had the same issue. If I find a nice example of a 1965 through 1967 coin in the wild, I wonder if it is a Special Mint Set coin or a great business strike. I have searched the internet for discussions on the issue. No one has pointed out die markers for any of the coins.
I mentioned it to a coin store owner/coin collector one time. He said it was easy to tell the difference by the strike. He had decades of experience, so I'm hoping in another 20-30 years the light will come on.
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Freespeech57's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2025  12:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Freespeech57 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It can be difficult, however, the SMS coins have a stronger and more distinctive strike, almost proof like finish and can be found with Cameo and even Ultra Cameo devices.
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Brandmeister's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2025  12:37 pm  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
https://goccf.com/t/471808

I know this specific question has come up repeatedly on CCF. I tried searching for the discussion that I remembered, but I couldn't find it. I believe the gist was this:

Proof: polished planchet, polished die, struck 2+ times at high pressure
SMS: polished planchet (?), polished die, struck once
Business: normal planchet, normal die, struck once

I can't recall if SMS planchets were polished or not. My gut feel is that they were. Maybe that was a coop, NGC, or PCGS article that I am remembering?
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Dearborn's Avatar
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BStrauss3's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2025  8:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BStrauss3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The blanks were specially prepared, but it doesn't say polished...

https://nnp.wustl.edu/library/book/348

The Annual Report of the Director of the Mint, Exhibit 3...


Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins
-----Burton
50+ year / Life / Emeritus ANA member (joined 12/1/1973)
Life member: Numismatics International, CONECA
Member: TNA, FtWCC, NETCC, EveryCountry (online) coin club
Owned by three cats and a wife of 40+ years (joined 1983)

Author: 3rd Edition of the Sample Slabs book, https://www.sampleslabs.info/
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Humanist1287's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  06:42 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Humanist1287 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
How about you post up an image of your coins.


Sure, Dearborn.

The 1965 and 1966 halves.
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins

1967 dated half.
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins

I would say if any of these fit the bill of what I would think a SMS half dollar would like, I'd say it would be the 1966. Again, I don't know. They were purchased all separately.
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BStrauss3's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  09:09 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BStrauss3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Semi PL and very few bag marks. Check
-----Burton
50+ year / Life / Emeritus ANA member (joined 12/1/1973)
Life member: Numismatics International, CONECA
Member: TNA, FtWCC, NETCC, EveryCountry (online) coin club
Owned by three cats and a wife of 40+ years (joined 1983)

Author: 3rd Edition of the Sample Slabs book, https://www.sampleslabs.info/
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Humanist1287's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  10:30 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Humanist1287 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So you think they are SMS?

I would have thought maybe the 66 one was.

I wanted to try to include both 65, 65 and 67 BU specimens as well as SMS, but if I already have the SMS coins, I don't think I'll bother.
Edited by Humanist1287
09/04/2025 11:12 am
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  10:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
All three look SMS to me, but I would prefer to make the determination in hand.

My three SMS half dollars came from my own broken sets, so I know they are what they are. They look obvious when sitting next to their business strike brethren. Of the three, the 1967 is the most proof-like. The other two look like very shiny and clean business strikes.
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  11:30 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I wanted to try to include both 65, 65 and 67 BU specimens as well as SMS, but if I already have the SMS coins, I don't think I'll bother.
It only matters in the 8166 album, which has places for both.
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cptbilly's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  12:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cptbilly to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Humanist1287: I don't collect circulation strike JFK's. For comparison's sake, perhaps this is helpful. . .photos of SMS coins (with JFK close-ups) inherited from my father:
1965 SMS, in "flat pack" cello. First one is from an earlier production run, described in RB as "semi-brilliant or satiny":
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins
This later 1965 SMS example has more brilliant fields, but not reaching Proof brilliance:
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins
Early Version (L) :: Later Version (R)
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins
The Mint upped its game with the 1966 and 1967 SMS releases:
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins
Circulated-Vs-SMS-Coins
" Even a clock that's stopped is right twice a day. "
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cladking's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  1:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cladking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You can tell when a coin is SMS but not when it isn't. The SMS are made to exacting standards by finite dies. You learn to recognize them. But there are a wide range of processes that apply in every strike making certainty impossible. However the problem arises with very high grade circ strikes; they are hard to differentiate. As a rule the services assume SMS unless clearly not. This is probably for the best anyway because most of the tweeners are SMS. This is for a simple reason; High grade clad from that era simply doesn't exist; at least its existence is the result of random forces and high grade coins were very exceptional.
Time don't fly, it bounds and leaps.
Edited by cladking
09/04/2025 1:58 pm
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  2:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
For comparison's sake, perhaps this is helpful. . .photos of SMS coins (with JFK close-ups) inherited from my father
Nice examples!
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Bump111's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2025  5:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bump111 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
at least its existence is the result of random forces and high grade coins were very exceptional.


This is why it matters. There's a big difference in price for SMS vs business strikes in the higher grades. I automatically assume that every nice 65-67 coin is SMS. If there were ways to differentiate, it would make the search more interesting.
"Nummi rari mira sunt, si sumptus ferre potes." - Christophorus filius Scotiae
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